What happens if I 3/4 refill and reset cartridge?

[The Hat]

ghwellsjr
I reported earlier on this in thread #10 and never got a good answer either ways.
I do know if you reset a cartridge with an empty reservoir you get a different result from resetting a cartridge with a half full reservoir.

All dough the printer via the chip shows full on both the cartridges the outcome however tends to vary,
I got completely mixed results when I did it.

The verdict is that the sensor is doing something (no idea what) but the chip had the last say most definitely.
My advice is never to under estimate the power of the chip and youll never go wrong..

 

[ghwellsjr]

Do you agree that if you reset a cartridge, it will always show full, no matter what its ink level actually is?

Then are you saying that a long time later, different things can happen depending on the actual prior ink level?

 

[The Hat]

ghwellsjr Do you agree that if you reset a cartridge, it will always show full, no matter what its ink level actually is?

Yes completely, both the printer and the chip would now be working on the assumption that its a full cartridge.
If you reset a cartridge and dont fill it then youll run of ink without any warning notices from the printer.

But if you reset a cartridge when there is still ink remaining in the reservoir then different things can happen.
I tried the above with 4 cartridges on two separate occasions and got completely different results from it each time
and was left scratching my head because it didnt make any sense at all.

Firstly I started with a set of refilled cartridges x 4 and when each cartridge in turn got to a half full reservoir visually,
I reset the chip and just carried on with my printing.

Now I did the same with each cartridge in turn, resetting it at full visually, over the course of printing this job
and changed the four cartridges twice, only stopping to reset each when full again.

I expected to run out of ink totally with no warnings each time but ended up with three different results altogether.
Pigment black showed low ink warning on the two occasions; (same result) yellow ran out of ink first time completely dry,
but not on the second fill, this time it kept on printing without any loss of colour.

Magenta showed low ink warning first time and the second time it too kept on printing with no loss of quality,
the cyan ran dry of ink first time too, but the second time it showed the low ink warning.

On the occasions when the cartridges just would not run out of ink, I did lose patience with them,
and refill them (a third time) just to complete the print run.

I did push each cartridge which had solid colour graphic blocks and bold text on the A4 sheet.
As this was a printed job and not test sheets I just got tired watching the dam thing print.

It was by no means a perfect scientific test, more like what would happen to anyone just doing a long print run
unattended and hoping the chips would look after their print head by not letting the cartridges run dry on them.

Conclusion never reset the chip and use a cartridge, unless you intend to refill it again first..

 

[OM2]

Conclusion never reset the chip and use a cartridge, unless you intend to refill it again first..

all of the replies are good
it would be great if we had a general rule guide: a set of no possibility of failing rules - i.e. no danger of frying your print head

suggested rules:

- you cannot rely on the printer to inform you on the level of ink left
just to be safe: assume you cannot rely on the printer

- assume that the resetter only resets the chip and put the counter back to zero
- whether right or wrong: safer to assume that the printer works by counting the number of ink squirts

1. refill ASAP when you get an ink warning
(most important after you have already refilled - since you most probably will have less ink than when the cartridge came filled fully)

2. refill to at least 3/4 of the reservoir tank
filling less will endanger you not getting a warning in time + possibility of frying the print head
(of course you should not over fill either)

have i missed anything?
i think the above rules will keep you safe always and you'll never do damage to the print head

 

[stratman]

Not sure where the 3/4 refill came from but it is underfilling. You are setting yourself up for problems by fighting the reliable system available.

New OEM Canon cartridges, at least the CLI-8 variety, are filled to about 4 or 5 mm from the top of the spongeless side IIRC. There is a balance that of ink residual in the sponge when "empty" (or whatever state the cartridge is in when you are to refill it) that is not directly apparent but could be determined it you want to weigh and calculated the amount of residual ink. But this is typically not necessary.

No matter how much ink is in the sponge or the spongeless side, one can fill the spongeless side of a CLI-8 and PGI-5 cartridge to between 2-4 mm from the top of the cartridge. If the sponge is not already saturated, the sponge will soak up ink and the level in the spongeless side will drop during the "resting" period of the Durchstich method. Then you may add more ink until the level is 2-4 mm from the top of the spongeless side and then you are good to go.

If the sponge is completely saturated when you first begin to refill, as long as you add ink to 2-4 mm from the top of the spongeless side then you will not overfill. If you do overfill, the second "resting" phase of the Durchstich method will display dripping from the ink exit port and you will be clued into the need for the amount of ink to equilibrate within the cartridge before using or storing the cartridge.

The approach with the newer cartridge models should be similar, depending on the level of ink from the top of the cartridge in the spongeless side as a guide to refilling. The method I described will let you use the cartridge until the printer tells you the cartridge is empty, at least with the CLI-8 and PGI-5 cartridges, because you are refilling the cartridge to at least OEM specs if not a little bit more. The cartridges appear to have a margin of error built into them, in this case a tolerance for slight over-filling, which works to our favor. Just make sure you do the second "resting" phase in the Durchstich method, where the cartridge is stood right-side up for 30-60 seconds, in order to see if anything drips out the ink exit port before using or storing the cartridge.

 

[ghwellsjr]

Hat, I'm scratching my head trying to figure out your description of your experiment. I thought you were saying that you started with four full and reset cartridges and then you started printing and visually monitored the ink level and when it got to 1/2 full in the reservoir, you reset the cartridge without refilling, and continued printing and monitoring and resetting. BUT, then you say you "changed the four cartridges twice". Was this a second experiment where you refilled? Did you swap in a different cartridge? You also talk about a second fill and refilling a third time. So I have no idea what you did.

But the bottom line is that if you always refill completely and reset, no matter what the previous state of the cartridge, then you can trust the printer's level display and you will never have a problem. Correct?

Startman, I think the 3/4 came from a top filler to avoid oversaturating the sponge. It doesn't apply to the German refill method.

We all agree: refill completely and reset before the printer says the cartridge is empty, correct?

 

[rodbam]

Using the German method I filled up to the top with just a small air bubble visible & no leaking as yet.
Regards Rod

 

[OM2]

Using the German method I filled up to the top with just a small air bubble visible & no leaking as yet.
Regards Rod

hmmm i thought i had it all sussed... but still am a little confused!

3/4 or nearly to the top?

3/4: this is the instructions i've seen for the german method + these are the instructions supplied by octokink
3/4 only refers to to the reservoir being 3/4 full - and not the ink cartridge as a whole

both the instructions i have read state that if u overfill, the you will get spillage!

also, am i correct in saying: 3/4 reservoir full (with sponge soaked) = 95% ink cartridge full?

 

[Redbrickman]

Been using the German method for the last couple of fills.

I'm using the SquEasy bottles from Octoink and have found that I don't even have to remove the needle when I am resting the cartridge after the first 3/4 fill of the reservoir. I thought I would have problems as the bottle will try to return to it's normal size after squeezing, but I have not had any problems.

I lay the cart and the bottle on it's side, right side up, have a cup of tea, or work on another cart, then return a few minutes later to top up.

I actually look forward to refilling, and find it quite relaxing

 

[stratman]

We all agree: refill completely and reset before the printer says the cartridge is empty, correct?

What do you mean by "refill completely" and at what point exactly do you refill before the cartridge is marked as empty by the printer?

The method I described does not require one to refill before the printer marks the cartridge as empty. I have never run dry prior to the cartridge marked as empty. Is there something different than the CLI-8's and PGI-5's with the newer cartridge models?