Epson WF-7710 CISS or Refillable Catridges

[Ink stained Fingers]

yes, the 'photo black' is dye based, for use on glossy 'photo papers'
the Photo Black is sometimes abbreviated as PB or PK, and the pigment based, 'normal' black as BK, 'normal' for use on normal - copy - paper or on matte papers. Why that difference - you could print with the PK on matte papers but you don't get a real good black, the BK ink gives you a better laserlike black on matte papers, and the BK ink would not adhere yo glossy surfaces, you could wipe it off under the slightest touch.

 

[eppyson]

Ink Stained Fingers -- Thanks for all your help. I'm now printing on the Epson WF-7710 using Epson 512 (aka 106 in Europe) ink with semi-success. I had a custom printer profile created from a source that I believe to be reliable. But, the profile only got me about half-way to where I had hoped to be in terms of color accuracy. B&W prints are spot-on, as are images that are dominated by softer colors. But, richer tones lose their character. Fire-engine red approaches maroon, U.S. Flag navy/blue appears almost black. Of course, tinkering with the image in PS can sometimes create an acceptable print, but the level of adjustment required seems excessive to me. Is it an imposition for me to ask whether I could try using the profile(s) you created for using Epson 512 (aka 106) ink in the WF-7710? I understand that your profiles were created for different paper than I’m using, but perhaps it would get me a bit closer to something acceptable.

 

[Ink stained Fingers]

I'm quite irritated by your report that colors are that much off, let me go through your postings to see how we can get a grip on those variations. There are several effects to consider - wrong color/hue altogether and/or missing saturation.

 

[Ink stained Fingers]

I wouldn't start playing around with other profiles; let's go through some of the technical details, your computer - specifically your monitor - is it one way or another calibrated, adjusted to a standard setting? The second question ist about the actual brightness of the monitor - it should not be too high when you compare an image on the monitor with a printout, if a printout appears to be too dark the monitor is too bright in lots of cases.
Of what type is your ambient light - changing - daylight and lamp light ?
And now to the profile generation itself - do you have a link to the company which did it ?

Which driver settings did you use to print the patch sheet with all the colors patches ?
And what media are you using - photo paper glossy or ?
You may run a test print with a test image of which you have an idea how it should look,
you may take this one

http://imageplace.co.uk/testfiles/downloads.html
and print this with your profile, and without profile but with the driver settings for the color 'Epson standard'
you may print them in A5 both on a A4 sheet to compare, and if there are visible differences please scan it and upload it here with the function 'Attach files'


And I forgot even a few more questions - which software are you using to print your images and the patch sheets, and which settings for print and color mgmt did you use ?

It can hapen quite easily that program and driver settings for color mgmt can double up or conflict with each other.

 

[eppyson]

Thanks Ink Stained Fingers. I'm grateful that you're willing to help me sort this out. It seems like I should give a short background of my printing environment before I answer your questions. I gather pre-existing digital images of historic subject matter from public-domain archives and sell prints online in sizes up to 12x18 inches. So, my digital files are either scans or professional-grade copy-photos of original flat subjects like old photographs or vintage color posters. The goal, of course, is to make a print that closely matches the colors of the original subject matter.

For years, I used (and still use) an Epson WF-7510 with OEM Epson 127 cartridges, printing on Canon SG-201 Semi-Gloss sheets. I use the factory profile that came with the WF-7510 which is "Epson IJ Printer 07". Using this setup, the color output has always been fantastic, i.e. colors are very true to both the digital image on the monitor, AND to the original subject matter. I almost never required any significant adjustment either on the digital file, or on the printer, to get excellent printed results.

So, now I'm switching to a WF-7710. I would love to use OEM Epson cartridges for the WF-7710, but the cost is just too damn high. I must find a cheaper ink solution. Hence my interest in using Epson 512 (aka 106) bottled ink in the WF-7710. I had hoped that a custom printer profile would "fix" the color shift and give me results similar to the WF-7510.

Something I think is important in my particular situation: I'm not using the monitor as my yardstick for color evaluation of prints. Instead, I'm using the prints that come out of my WF-7510 with OEM cartridges as the yardstick. I was taught long ago that a backlit monitor and a printed sheet are two different worlds, and that the monitor should never be the yardstick when a print is the intended use of the image. So, I tend to bristle at suggestions (common across the web) that users should reduce brightness of their monitors if their prints are too dark. That doesn't seem applicable in my particular situation.

OK, so with that longer-than-expected explanation, I'll answer your specific questions in the following post and hopefully your trained eye will spot something as a possible cause of the problem. Thanks again!

 

[eppyson]

Skipping your questions for now about monitor. I’m using prints from WF-7510 as the yardstick for color, and comparing them to the prints of WF-7710, trying to make the WF-7710 prints more closely resemble the WF-7510 prints.

You asked “Which driver settings did you use to print the patch sheet with all the colors patches ?” I was instructed to use Adobe Color Printer Utility to print the color patches because it strips out color management. Used that, and made SURE that color management was turned off in the printer driver.

You asked “And what media are you using?” I’m using Canon SG-201 semigloss sheets.

You asked, "which software are you using to print your images and the patch sheets, and which settings for print and color mgmt did you use ?" For the patch target sheets, I used Adobe Color Printer Utility. For normal printing, I use Photoshop Elements. On the WF-7510 with OEM cartridges, the color management is set to allow the printer to manage color, using the factory profile "Epson IJ Printer 07." For the WF-7710, I set Color Management to Photoshop Elements, select the custom printer profile, and select a Rendering Intent of "Perceptual". With that setting, the Epson driver's Color Matching settings are all grayed-out, and the driver's "Color Options" window says "Printer Color Management features have been disabled..." All of this is per the instructions of the creator of the custom profile.

I will experiment with the test targets you suggested and report back.

 

[Ink stained Fingers]

The color mismatch problems are quite typical for the situation that driver/color mgmt settings to print the patch sheets and to print your images with this new profile later on,, but I must admit that I'm not familiar with the necessary settings in the Adobe software you are using, I'm using other software to print like Qimage. So I hope that some Adobe user can jump in to clarify these points. The ICM option in the driver, at the extended settings , should be off in both cases - printing the patch sheet and printing your images.