CLI-8 refills - Ink permanence vs. accuracy vs. gamut

[tony22]

Has anyone done any testing to see which of the aftermarket inks for the CLI-8 provide the best color accuracy to the originals? Best longevity? Possibly even a wider gamut?

I notice Inkjetmall has been advertising some Canon ink availability (although not Colorlife 100). I've used their Espon inks and had been very impressed.

 

[marceltho]

The question was not what YOU liked, or who sells what and their service....
This forum starts to be more and more an organized advertisement for specific members.
You could have answered with your last sentence only:

" I have not tested this ink, so cant help you there."

I am not an administrator, but it's time to set some new rules here I guess.....

 

[websnail]

Has anyone done any testing to see which of the aftermarket inks for the CLI-8 provide the best color accuracy to the originals? Best longevity? Possibly even a wider gamut?

I believe Grandad on these forums has carried out research on some aspects of this but it was quite a while ago and I'm a little hazy on what they covered exactly although I do believe that longevity/fade resistance was covered.

A fair amount of searching should help on that score...

 

[tony22]

Thanks Websnail. I'll do a bit more searching.

 

[marceltho]

Probably this is what you are looking for ?

 

[tony22]

Marceltho, thank you! The work that Grandad and the others did here is really quite something. I was interested in seeing that the old Epson Glossy Photo appears to be pretty good with respect to gas fading using Canon inks. Lucky for me I have quite a bit of this stuff left over from my Epson printing days. Unfortunately, it also shows that in general the 3rd party inks (as suspected) do not do quite as well. I'll have to think about this a bit.

 

[websnail]

@Marcetho: That was the one... Thanks for locating it.

Unfortunately, it also shows that in general the 3rd party inks (as suspected) do not do quite as well. I'll have to think about this a bit.

To be fair to the 3rd party inks, they are considerably cheaper than the OEMs and it's also worth remembering that the OEM's develop paper and ink to work together, to get the best symbiotic relationship on all fronts.

On top of that the OEM's obviously guard their synthetic ink patents quite zealously so anything that comes close to recreating their properties has to find a new/different way of creating a similar effort/property without falling foul of a bunch of lawyers. Even if the patent isn't in breach they're not going to be above nuisance lawsuits claiming infringement anyway, just to keep the 3rd parties busy, while increasing their costs.

The "fun" of business.

 

[Grandad35]

In doing that work we talked to a number of people in the ink business and learned that the same companies that make the ink for the OEMs often also make ink for the "quality" 3rd party ink market, but they have an agreement with the OEMs not to use the OEM formulation (obviously) or make their own inks "too good". There are sometimes patents involved with the OEM formulations, but it is possible to make good inks without violating active patents.

I know someone who worked on designing a plant for one of the major ink suppliers, and he told me that the manufacturing cost difference between an OEM formulation and in-house formulations is probably less than a dollar per liter (32 ounces). The explanation that the OEM inks have more expensive components and that is why they cost more has more than a little exaggeration involved.

We also inquired about the possibility of adding stabilizers to improve their own ink's longevity. We were told that there are very few people who care about this, and that it wasn't worth the effort. Sadly, I have to agree, as the vast majority of inkjet ink is used in low quality applications or by people who aren't concerned about longevity.

Another point of interest. I have very few complaints about my prints fading, but one daughter had problems with photos taped to her refrigerator. I have worked with electrostatic ozone generating devices in industry, and my nose is attuned to the smell of ozone - I could smell the ozone from their "air purifier". Once I showed her data on the dangers of breathing ozone, she threw the air purifier away. Her fading greatly decreased at the same time. For prints that I want to keep, I print them on swellable paper and frame them behind glass and locate them where they aren't exposed to direct sunlight. I don't see any appreciable fading after several years.

 

[martin0reg]

Yes ink formulation has to be kept secretly, but if an ink composition is the same, who can accuse?
The imitation of design is evident, but a composition of color dyes/pigments...?

As the experts pointed out: it is the combination of BOTH ink AND paper, what makes good color accuracy AND durability.
There are reviews of third party ink but the multitude of potential combinations makes it hard to compare and research.

Here in germany I know only one inkshop who adverts the longetivity of their canon refill ink ("tintenalarm"), but the test shows only the color accuracy, not the fading:
http://www.tintenalarm.de/Druckerpa...P4600-IP4700-IP3600-MP540-CLI521-PGI520BK.php
I have not tested the ink as I am stocked up with good ink by IS (shops are known here) and by inkswiss (label) and arici (producer?). Also recommended here is hobbicolors and OCP.

But you have to try out for yourself - and should post your own review here!

 

[wilko]

Longevity is no longer a problem. Digital photos are stored on hard drives or recordable media. So what if print outs fade after a few years. Just print out further copies.

Far more important is the quality of the print and if you want to pay 10 per OEM cartridge (in the UK ) plus extra for Canon paper, then you will have top quality prints plus longevity.

However, if you prefer to have lots of prints at around 40p-50p a cartridge with slightly less quality, then Hobbicolors, Image Specialists or OCP are your answer.

Personally I have found that any prints survive perfectly providing they are stored correctly.