Chosing between the Canon Pro-100 and G-4200 for printing CD sleeves

[lesvisible]

Greetings all;


This is my first posting here so, if you would, please bear with me if I miss a point of protocol or etiquette. I have about a dozen musical CDs in release and out there at most of the major sites. I can't afford going to manufacturers for my printed sleeves. There are so many different sleeves that I need and I don't need hundreds and thousands of each. I have purchased a CD duplicator and now I need a printer. Ink is a big question, given the costs and I am planning on the one hand to purchase what is needed to refill my cartridges from Precision Color and on the other hand it is no problem. What I mean is that I am torn between getting the Canon Pro 100 or the Canon G-4200. I know that the Pro 100 will handle heavier cardstock. I do not know what the limits of the G-4200 are. I have seen where it will print 64# cardstock but I suspect it might well handle 20 or 30 more than that and I will be hand feeding each sheet. I'm not that concerned with quality of image on the sleeve. Adequate is fine with me. My bigger concern is the ease of printing, whether it be 5X5 stock or bigger sheets that I would construct the 5X5 out of. I know it's a lot of work but I have a lot of time.


If the G-4200 will handle cardstock between 80 and 100 I think that is sufficient for making sleeves. I am stunned that in the weeks I have been researching this labor, I cannot find anywhere that someone has detailed the process. I can't find sleeves for printing; meaning sheets of paper designed for this purpose. Some paper, like Red River is very expensive. Surely there is a cheaper alternative? If I can get the G-4200 and it will do the job then I want that because the ink thing is covered. I know I am getting a much better printer with the Pro-100 and it will handle much larger paper formats, allowing me to get several 5X5's out of each sheet. I don't know whether pigment or dye matter in my case.


I have put years into composing my singer songwriter works and I am dedicated to the message that is contained in the songs. I want to try to reach a wider audience now as I don't know how many years I have left, or how much longer my voice and capacity will remain acceptable. I don't mind the work involved. My time is my own now. It's all very confusing. I see where certain Epson and perhaps Brother printers offer me much more facility for what I want to do, like the Workhorse line and such but I am a DEDICATED Canon fan. I Love Canon and want to stick with Canon; whether it is my camcorders or whatever I might have, if Canon makes it, I buy Canon but... sometimes Canon is expensive, like with their inks and paper. This is why I would prefer if the G-4200 would suffice for my needs. I'm not interested in the other G-tank models. I want the high end one.


I don't want to bother with ink refilling of cartridges but I will. From what I hear, it is not difficult and the Pro-100 looks fantastic for so many things and I could do large art photos of the album covers and performance shots for my wall. People say the G-4200 is very noisy and slow. I'm not sure either of those concerns matter to me if it will do the job and print cardstock of a sufficient strength and thickness. For all I know, 64# is thick enough. I will be going to Staples to see if that is the case. I just don't know at the moment. I hope there is someone out there knowledgeable enough about my problem and how to proceed.


If you like Willie Nelson or Bob Dylan, or songs with deep and meaningful lyrics I would be glad to send you a selection as well in repayment for your advice. I don't know if I have overstepped here by saying that or if the mention of ink refill use is unacceptable. If so I apologize. I don't know what the atmosphere is like here. I will certainly adjust to the proper procedures once I know what they are.


So... if you have an awareness of these two printers and how each of them might serve my needs, or any answers to getting less expensive cardstock, or heavy paper, or if there is a manufacturer who makes sleeve templates on the stock I would really appreciate your insight.


Thank you for the time taken in reading this.


Les Visible

 

[berttheghost]

Hi, Les,

I'm a bit confused here (as usual ...) Are you really going to use cd sleeves to print on or are you perhaps going to use transparent cd 'jewel' cases with printed cardboard inserts?

Whatever media you choose to print on, it needs to be inkjet compatible, otherwise the ink may simply run off before drying or flake off afterward.

Are you also planning to print on the cd itself?

Do you need to market your cds? That is, do you need to package your cds for a competitive retail environment? Do you need attractive packaging? Does it need to withstand retail display for a year or more?

I'd consider the canon maxify for its large pigment ink tanks, print speed, and duplex output for 2 sided inserts. You probably don't need photo quality output unless you choose to go with attractive ladies on the covers.

 

[lesvisible]

I'm hoping to print on cardboard or cardstock. That's it. I'm either printing on the CD's or just as likely putting labels on. I have a web presence to market the CD's as well as being on most of the larger web site markets like Amazon and others but I have no stock. As it stands people just buy the mp3's for download. I want to provide CD's and want a printer that will handle cardstock. I know the Pro-100 will but I am not sure of the limits for the G-4200. If the G-4200 will handle appropriate cardstock then that is what I am going to go with. I'm also looking for heavy paper that is designed for CD sleeves but I haven't found anything yet. Thanks for mentioning the Maxify. I haven't heard of that. I will go look. I appreciate your advice. Thank you!

 

[stratman]

From the Canon G-4000 User Manual: http://gdlp01.c-wss.com/gds/7/0300025657/01/G4000ser_OnlineManual_Win_EN_V01.pdf

- Paper jams may occur if you use 5x5 cut up paper. (page 33)

You'll want to use a larger sheet of paper and trim after printing. A large enough piece of paper and you may be able to print 2 covers per page.

- Automatic Document Feeder Paper weights on p.46.

- More on Paper Weights p.165 and beyond. Make especial note of Unsupported Media Types p.169.

Some paper, like Red River is very expensive. Surely there is a cheaper alternative?

I have used Microcenter's inexpensive house brand photo paper with nice results. But this is subject to opinion. You need to buy different papers and try to see which you like best.

any answers to getting less expensive cardstock, or heavy paper

If the cover you print is going to be inside a plastic CD case then you can print on whatever paper stock you wish. You do not need to go with anything heavy, but I would advise nothing as light as typical copy paper.

You did not mention, or maybe I missed it, whether you wanted to double side print your covers. Depending on how thick your paper you can forget about Duplex Printing and will need to manually flip the paper over and carefully align it to print properly. I have done it on a small scale and it is time consuming when learning.

I don't know whether pigment or dye matter in my case.

The age old question. If longevity of the print (fade resistance) is paramount then go with Pigment-based inks. If water resistance is important then go with Pigment-based inks as well. I have CD covers I printed several years ago that look good, but they have been out of sunlight packed away.

I will be going to Staples

It would be great for you to go to a store that has demo models of printers that you can see for yourself. Take along some of your own paper to see how it is handles by the printer and the quality of the output.

You have not mentioned what application you are going to use. I have used Acoustica CD Label Maker along with Photoshop with good success. You can download a trial version of Acoustica to test. Others will tell you their favorites.

While you are at Staples check out the guillotine paper trimmers!

 

[lesvisible]

Thank you for replying. I am not planning on printing inside the sleeve. I simply want to make cardboard or cardstock or even heavy paper sleeves that the CD will go into. The sleeve will have the album cover on front and the song list and some details on the back. The CD will either be direct printed or have a label. I have used Acoustica before. It is good software. I had planned so far to print on sheets of paper and cut out the sleeve and then glue it. This is because I have not been able to find printable sleeve kits that you just detach from the paper after printing. Avery and others make all kinds of things but I can't find this. If I get the Pro 100 Canon then I can use larger sheets and I know that the Pro will print heavy cardstock but the ink is expensive. This is why I am considering the G-4200 with the ink tanks but I don't know how heavy a paper it will take, which I am willing to feed into the printer one at a time. I believe the G-4200 has a tray that does not roll up the paper and that would be ideal. It's choosing between the printers that is the big issue. I understand that the ink kits from Precision Color are quite good and in that case, if I am not a total dolt the Pro is the way to go for quality. As you say, pigment is the most enduring however and the Pro I think uses dye. This would make the G-4200 a better bet I suppose, depending on if it will take a heavier stock. For all I know the listed 64# weight paper for the G-4200 is actually sufficient for the sleeve. I have to go to a paper store and check. If that is the case then I am going to get the G-4200. In any case, thank you again for your trouble in granting me your advice.

 

[Ink stained Fingers]

if longevity is your concern you rather should not consider the G series printers, even their genuine Canon inks are by far not as good as the Chromalife dye inks of other printers, and refill will not improve that. As @stratman already commented pigment inks will perform by far the best, as used in printers like the Pro10s, and refill options are available. Genuine Chromalife inks of the Pro100 may as well be a useful choice, but dye refill inks will not perform at all like Canon inks in this respect. This applies to sleeves as much as to direct prints onto the CD's. Considering manual handling of CD's
I would recommend direct print or PVC labels, no paper labels on CD's !!!

 

[lesvisible]

Thank you, ink stained fingers. I was leaning toward the Pro 100 anyway and I think you put me over the edge. You have some very nice people here and I really appreciate that. It's getting harder and harder to find real human beings and what I decry most is the loss of manners and common courtesy. I still get up from the table if a woman enters the room and try to speak with deference in all respects but these days the brutish attitude of indifferent people blows my mind. Maybe it is materialism. Maybe it is selfishness. Maybe it is fear, or greed or all of these things. I've spent my life trying to bring a better message to the world and have to get out of the way of pornographic rap now. If you would like a selection of my work, or if anyone here would, simply give me an address to send it to. I guarantee you will not be disappointed. I come from an age or an awareness where muses are still at work and I am certain when you hear you will recognize the heart and the lyrical integrity... sometimes it is even funny. Seriously... give it a shot. The postage is on me as is the thumb drive (grin). Interesting things happen now and again and this might be one of those times. Thanks a lot for answering me. I have spent weeks on the search engines and already, though I haven't heard anything definitively, just coming here has cleared my mind about the choices and that was all I really wanted.

 

[mikling]

if longevity is your concern you rather should not consider the G series printers, even their genuine Canon inks are by far not as good as the Chromalife dye inks of other printers, and refill will not improve that. As @stratman already commented pigment inks will perform by far the best, as used in printers like the Pro10s, and refill options are available. Genuine Chromalife inks of the Pro100 may as well be a useful choice, but dye refill inks will not perform at all like Canon inks in this respect. This applies to sleeves as much as to direct prints onto the CD's. Considering manual handling of CD's
I would recommend direct print or PVC labels, no paper labels on CD's !!!

In further testing for the G series inkset which I am close to completing, it becomes apparent that the chosen OEM color density is sometimes half of what normal Canon OEM colors are typically. What does this mean? Well, the printer needs to put down much more liquid on the paper to obtain the same color as a normal model would have to..........its' ink usage is much higher in real use. So Canon in addition to not providing as durable an ink is also ensuring that either this ink is not to be used for refilling normal desktops or ensures that you use more of it whicle giving it to you for less cost.

Cute!

 

[Ink stained Fingers]

@lesvisible - thanks for your feedback, feel free to raise your questions, you can tap a wealth of information here from the members to help you to sort out the essential requirements to buy and run a printer effectively - there may be quite some differences for business or private use.

 

[Ink stained Fingers]

In further testing for the G series inkset which I am close to completing, it becomes apparent that the chosen OEM color density is sometimes half of what normal Canon OEM colors are typically.

That's very interesting and confirms assumptions that Canon is playing similar tricks with the inks like Epson in their L.. and ET... series printers - Epson does not offer bottled Claria inks for their tank system printers and Canon does not offer bottled Chromalife dye inks either, and plays games with the ink density on top of it. All those details are not becoming visible in their high gloss product brochures, they hide such information from their prosp. customers.