Canon firmware/driver updates - A matter of concern?

[The Hat]

stratman
I think you are getting confused by the term Windows Explorer so let me try to unravel it,
I have not being great at it so far have i, so here goes.

Windows Internet Explorer which you rightly explained is what you use for (Browsing) and so do most guys.
The big BUT follows. The other Windows Explorer is the program that your Windows operating system uses to display
ALL images with-in the Windows picture area i.e. what you see on your screen, two different Applications.

This is Windows Explorer dialogue print preview displayed for Photoshop

Here is another example when you click on Page Setup this time its for Canon

The specify Margins Button is clearly visible
--------------------------

You are also perfectly right in your description of a DLL file,
the software developers do use Windows Explorer to project their images onto you screen by using these very small DLL files (Shortcuts),
they are stored temporarily in Explorer for this very function.

Its like giving someone a flat-pack table to build for you, it get built perfectly
(per instructions) the way you want it without you having to do the work yourself.

On the firmware issue I said I dont fully know how or when these things get up-dated
but I am not going to roll them back to an earlier version and risk making a pigs ear of it
and end up with just a big black ornament, I am stupid to a point.

The USB port switch works by connecting up to four Computers by their USB (A) plug into the back of this port switch (B) plug x four cables,
and only outputs by a single USB (A) plug it's the middle cable that is then connected to a four port USB 2 hub then to three other 4 port USB hubs.

It is described in my Control Panel as a Keyboard and has one functioning key (Scroll-Lock)
so when you want to print you simply hit the scroll lock key twice and all of my printers are then available
to me to use without have to move away from the Computer that I am working at.

The printers are plugged into any of the available plug sockets on my powered USB hubs;
the USB printers that are USB 1 are plugged into a USB 1 hub to avoid confusion and pop-up notices.
-----------------------
PeterBJ
I get the same print dialogue box in all of my applications
except "quick print" and "print preview" regardless of which application I use to print from.
That is the picture that I used in post# 17 as an example.

To set the margins in Word it is done on the task bar in (Page Layout) and in the Word pad
if you highlight print preview then in there you can bring up page setup to alter or set your margins.

When I print and set my margins in the printer margins dialogue box I can only use increments above
5 mm for them to take effect despite the fact that it indicates a range from 0 to 30 mm increments.

Since the margins have shifted in my canon printers I just dont bother with them anymore
and just use the default setting of 5mm and leave it at that.

My Canon printers also print Borderless but that does not seem to have be affected by the margin changes,
I think I will have to change to being just a default believer and forget the hymen books..

 

[stratman]

As I suspected, we had a failure to communicate. The window that pops up in your example is not what I would refer to as a Windows Explorer or even Windows Explorer-like window. I would agree that it is a printer dialogue box or window that operates within the Windows shell of which Windows Explorer is a part of. The following is what is classically thought of as Windows Explorer (image from Google - ignore the extra writing on the image):

Regardless, I now understand what you meant. My entire point of pursuing this was the possibility that one of your four computers was oddly acting as a server for printing - the computer opening up a classic Windows Explorer window first. Any changes to this "server" computer would then appear to affect all the other computers. But that is not the situation, so changes have been made to the files and registry on each computer and/or the firmware of each printer if the alterations to print functionality are occurring globally with every computer and every printer. It is also possible that the application you are using is affecting your margins as well.

I did read about your Manual share 4 port USB 2 switch by Googling before. From your first description of your setup I thought you had your printers plugged into the computers and the USB hubs connected to the Switch.

I dont use the LAN connections on any of my printers but use a Manual share 4 port USB 2 switch
connected to four USB hubs, three which are USB 2 hubs and one is USB 1.

To that there are six inkjet printers and two Laser printers that are connected to my four computers via USB cables.
It means I can print from any one computer at a time and can also print from all of my printers at the same time.

That didn't make sense and was why I kept asking you to clarify.

Given the arrangement of your network, it is possible that any printer on the USB hub that is powered on can be controlled by the single computer whose port is active on the Switch. So, an update could affect more than one computer. For reasons I have already mentioned in a previous post I doubt this is what happened, but it is possible. (Unfortunately I did not wake up next to Miss America this morning)

Looking on the Canon web site update page for my MP830 I noticed that firmware and driver updates are separate files that need to be run separately. You need the drivers installed before you can flash the firmware. Did you only update the drivers, only the firmware, or do both? Also, on the firmware download page is an explanation of what the firmware is for, what it does, and how to perform the update flash. In these instructions is the following:

- Connect a single MP830 unit to the computer via the USB cable, and disconnect all other printer units. The upgrade cannot be performed properly if two or more printer units are connected to the computer.

This makes me wonder if the same warning accompanies the firmware flash instructions for the printer you updated (if you tried flashing the firmware at all versus just doing a driver update). If so, how a hub of connected printers may affect a flash to one printer is a question and a concern given your story - barring more failure to communicate between us - of updating only one computer/printer.

It is possible you could brick your printer or result in flaky function by flashing back to an earlier firmware. I have no experience or knowledge of others doing this with Canon printers.

 

[The Hat]

stratman
we had a failure to communicate between us

You see I can say without dough that we are singing from the same hymen sheet now.

I would agree that it is a printer dialogue box or window that operates within the Windows shell of which Windows Explorer is a part of.
The following is what is classically thought of as Windows Explorer

Hurray Glory halleluiah you see I can preach after all.
Everybody makes the same mistake into thinking that the example you have shown above is the only dialogue window that can be truey called "Explorer".

I have put a screen shot of what was running in Explorer when I hit the print button in Photoshop just to show you Explorer in action.

Given the arrangement of your network, it is possible that any printer on the USB hub that is powered on can be controlled by the single computer whose port is active on the Switch. So, an update could affect more than one computer. For reasons I have already mentioned in a previous post I doubt this is what happened, but it is possible. (Unfortunately I did not wake up next to Miss America this morning)

I can partially agree with you but only in reference to my printers which this is all about.
If I applied an update to one of my printers it could possibly affect all of them together in one foul swoop,
I dont really know if this is possible or not.

My only sin was to install a new printer and driver to my setup and in my ignorance paid the price,
I will admit that in doing so I may have caused this multiple conversion to take place in all of my printers.
I have never done any new firmware installations or flashes in any of my printers yet and dont plan to either.

However my setup with my Computers are as such that no migration of any kind can take place
thats 100% guaranteed and no updates or infections can move, jump or crossover the USB cable to the other Computers,
in fact you have a much better chance with Miss America so dont give up just yet.

 

[stratman]

Everybody makes the same mistake into thinking that the example you have shown above is the only dialogue window that can be truey called "Explorer".

I have put a screen shot of what was running in Explorer when I hit the print button in Photoshop just to show you Explorer in action.

Canon refers to printer dialogue box as the Printer Driver Setup Window in my printer's manual, not Windows Explorer. To call it Windows Explorer was at best ambiguous and confusing. An image of files/processes running does not prove the Printer Driver Setup Window is called Windows Explorer, but it does demonstrate what Windows Explorer can do.

From Wikipedia :

While Windows Explorer is a term most commonly used to describe the file management aspect of the operating system, the Explorer process also houses the operating systems search functionality and File Type associations (based on filename extensions), and is responsible for displaying the desktop icons, the Start Menu, the Taskbar, and the Control Panel. Collectively, these features are known as the Windows shell.

Also from Wikipedia :

The Windows Shell is not to be confused with Windows' window manager (the Desktop Window Manager in Windows Vista and forward or the USER subsystem in previous versions), which displays windows and controls how they look.

Lastly from Wikipedia :

Windows USER is a component of the Microsoft Windows operating system that provides core functionality for building simple user interfaces. The component has existed in all versions of Windows, and includes functionality for window management, message passing, input processing and standard controls.

Windows USER provides a large part of the core user experience for Microsoft Windows. Historically, USER was responsible for:[1] [2]

* Causing windows to be drawn
* Obscuring overlapping windows behind others
* Window size and positioning
* Providing all the standard window management controls (such as close boxes or title bars)
* Providing the standard Windows menu bar
* Providing of standard controls (such as button, List box or Edit Box)
* Providing dialog box management (short-cut keys, tab key processing)
* Processing all user input from the mouse and keyboard
* The desktop background image
* Drawing all standard visual elements
* Inter-process communication using Dynamic Data Exchange
* Mouse pointer cursor display and management
* Data transfer (Clipboard)

The Canon Printer Driver Setup Window is code written by Canon using and augmented in appearance by Windows USER (or derivative depending on your operating system version). It is not Windows Explorer.

If I applied an update to one of my printers it could possibly affect all of them together in one foul swoop,
I dont really know if this is possible or not.

My only sin was to install a new printer and driver to my setup and in my ignorance paid the price,
I will admit that in doing so I may have caused this multiple conversion to take place in all of my printers.
I have never done any new firmware installations or flashes in any of my printers yet and dont plan to either.

However my setup with my Computers are as such that no migration of any kind can take place
thats 100% guaranteed and no updates or infections can move, jump or crossover the USB cable to the other Computers

If all you have done is install a printer and its drivers then you have not flashed any firmware. All changes - new files and registry entries - were made on the local harddrive, not to the printer's firmware.

My experience with driver installs/updates and firmware flashes is that they are carried out at separate times, not together sequentially and automatically. You perform one or the other but not both with a singular click of the mouse or stroke on your keyboard, probably because flashing firmware is so critical that no other operations should be tethered to it. Driver installs and updates, on the other hand, have more leeway for error and can be uninstalled and reinstalled with much less worry.

The problem with uninstalls is that the software's own uninstall routine can be sloppy in removing all or sufficient files and registry entries and may cause issues. That is what makes applications like Total Uninstall and Ashampoo Uninstaller so useful - you start them up before you install an application, it monitors all the changes made during the installation, and then uses that list of changes to oftentimes remove more files and registry entries made than the software's own uninstall routine does. How do I know? Because I have used these programs after uninstalling applications and they find more things to remove. Because of these functionality, an application like Total Uninstall may more thoroughly uninstall a driver update and allow you to reinstall an older driver for your printer. It won't work for firmware flashes or if another application or your operating system is the cause for your printer margin issue.

I repeat mentioning these uninstaller applications because you said uninstall/reinstall of the driver did not correct your printer margin issue. Registry changes left behind after an uninstall could be the cause. But since you say the issue occurs with every printer and computer, that there is no communication between computers, and you only installed one driver on one computer/printer combo before the problem occurred, it is possible the problem is from an another application's setting that has been altered. It is possible there is more communication between computers or printers than thought. However, unless the printer driver was of the "universal" type, I would expect more than printer margins to be affected by a different model's printer driver installation. Then again....

in fact you have a much better chance with Miss America so dont give up just yet.

Don't bet on it.

 

[mikling]

Flashing is unlikely to be carried out without major precautions by the manufacturer. The downside risk to anything going wrong in a firmware update is huge....like a dead printer. Even if you could perform a reflash after an error it's just something that the average home user would not be doing. I doubt manufacturers both Epson and Canon would be carrying such things out. HP did receive a patent years ago to carry such things out but I am not sure that they were using it.

My .02

The best way to confirm Hat's situation is to take the printer and attach it to a clean install and see what happens.

 

[stratman]

Even if you could perform a reflash after an error it's just something that the average home user would not be doing. I doubt manufacturers both Epson and Canon would be carrying such things out. HP did receive a patent years ago to carry such things out but I am not sure that they were using it.

Not talking about a failed flash but flashing back to an earlier version of the firmware. It is possible that the flash routine may prevent this or certain registers in the EEPROM will not be completely cleared despite what appears as a successful flash.

The best way to confirm Hat's situation is to take the printer and attach it to a clean install and see what happens.

Agree. One clean, virgin computer connected to one printer. No USB hubs. No switch. Fresh install of the older printer driver used before the margin problem surfaced. Fresh install of the version of Illustrator used before the problem arose (if that is the software The Hat is using to initiate printing from). Same version of the operating system without any updates he might have done prior to the issue appearing.

Maybe a Restore to an earlier date than the problem occurred if he uses that function on his operating system would be sufficient to test.

 

[mikling]

What's a virgin computer?

Ok, a few years ago I went to a restaurant and was served by a pair of waiters who carried name tags on them. The name of the first waiter was Dick and the second waiter was Hymen. No kidding.

 

[stratman]

What's a virgin computer?

I've heard computers in Canada were easy. Time to schedule a road trip to Toronto!

 

[PeterBJ]

I checked Canon.dk and Canon.ie for firmware upgrade tools for the MP 830. The result: "Sorry, we were not able to find any downloads that match your search criteria"

The Canon USA site offers two firmware upgrades, one to be run from Windows and one to be run from Mac OS. The Windows version: MP830 Firmware Upgrade Utility Ver. 1.13 (Win...
File Name: fu123mp830win113us.exe 10/30/09 7.78MB

Why this difference, and what damage could a firmware update intended for a USA model to to a European model ?

For iP 4700 neither US nor Irish site offers any firmware upgrades.

For printable area on the iP 4700 the Irish side specifies: http://www.canon.ie/Support/Consume....aspx?faqtcmuri=tcm:24-669966&page=1&type=faq , this is not 3mm margin on all sides. This was last modified aug 09.

The Hat wrote:
...and I vaguely remember downloading a newer version from the Canon website...

This was not by accident the US site? But I think only side effect of using a US driver would be loss op CD-printing capability?
The mystery deepens.

 

[stratman]

Why this difference, and what damage could a firmware update intended for a USA model to to a European model ?

Don't know. Since I have a printer sold in the USA, I enabled CD printing by selecting Euro in Service Mode. Despite different voltage power used with European models and US models, the only difference was being able to print on CD's and the page size requiring me to manually select 8.5" X 11" when making a copy using the controls on the printer. Looks like these drivers are universal with respect to country/region they can be used for but that choosing your proper country of origin from which to download the driver will ensure that the default language, CD-print capability, and paper sizes are appropriate.

Anyone know how to permanently set 8.5" X 11" as the default paper size via the LCD screen on the MP830?

I think only side effect of using a US driver would be loss op CD-printing capability?

See above.

For printable area on the iP 4700 the Irish side specifies: http://www.canon.ie/Support/Consumer_Pr p;type=faq , this is not 3mm margin on all sides. This was last modified aug 09.

Interesting. Does this mean The Hat should not have been able to have a 3mm margin on the shorter horizontal axis of a portrait oriented (not landscape mode) page since August 2009? It seemed like The Hat noticed his issue long after that date. Did The Hat change from Portrait to Landscape mode and went from 3mm to 5 mm margins? We are whittling down the possibilities. More info is needed.