B&W on Canon Printers

[mikling]

I think martinoreg has answered the question of flushing. Beyond the flushing, the printhead has an internal reservoir of ink just above the nozzle bank. For this reason, I usually rinse the printhead under the faucet until the water comes out near clear from the inlet ports. That way I never get color contamination from the colored inks when switching. Just be careful of minimizing the water on the electronic board on the printhead.

 

[ghwellsjr]

Mikling, I had a couple other questions that I'd like an answer on, please:

Ilford has a .pdf that warns "As with all nanoporous coated media, when used with dye based inks, a certain amount of fading can be seen after a short period of time." I was planning on doing some fade tests with different kinds of papers but it would seem pointless to do it on swellable paper, don't you think?

Contact me for Profiles for those for the complete Canon CLI-8 through to CLI-221 color profiles for those when using my inks. There still remains a Kodak product with those as well.

I have only used printers with cartridges up to CLI-8. I'm aware of the CLI-221 but are there other cartridges in between?

 

[mikling]

As far as fading goes, if I have a print that I will have displayed in a bright room, I use my R1800 for that real pigment inks.

You may well test some swellable but it is well known that these types of paper are well suited for extending print durability like the pdf and boxcover says. Grandad35 also mentioned that he also uses the same strategy of swellable for dispayed prints. It is an excellent option for those who occasionally print photos for open display. Switching over to a pigment ink printer and occasional printing of cherished photos are not a good union. The pigment ink printer really likes to see constant service that occasional printing would not provide.

No there are no cartridges in between as best as I can tell. But I should add that there are BCI-7 in the Asian market that carry the same chips as the CLI-8. I have some and use them where CLI-8s are called for. Then again there are European variants of the PGI-220 etc that are electronically different.

 

[martin0reg]

...
Ilford has a .pdf that warns "As with all nanoporous coated media, when used with dye based inks, a certain amount of fading can be seen after a short period of time." I was planning on doing some fade tests with different kinds of papers but it would seem pointless to do it on swellable paper...

A test of the lightfastness of different papers and inks is much appreciated.
Because there are only very few tests of non OEM material.
Also a comparison of microporous to swellable, because microporous is the most used and easy to handle but swellable supposed to be more durable with dye. A comparison would show the difference in real world.

 

[ghwellsjr]

Now I am confused. I thought nanoporous was just another name for swellable. How can you tell which papers are which type? Which type is the HP Premium Plus Glossy? I can't tell from HP's website that it is either type.

 

[pharmacist]

No: nanoporous (tiny holes) is not swellable (gel based).

 

[lin]

Now I am confused. I thought nanoporous was just another name for swellable. How can you tell which papers are which type? Which type is the HP Premium Plus Glossy? I can't tell from HP's website that it is either type.

HP Premium Plus Glossy is swellable.

One way you could tell, is take a printed swellable glossy photo paper and run it under water or pour some water over it. Then take a piece of paper towel and wipe the swellable photo paper, you will notice that the coating on top of the paper is rub off. That is the sticky polymer gel kind of gets rub off and so the area where you wipe your picture, the image of your picture will come off as well.

With microporous or nanoporous glossy photo paper, when you run your print under water or pour some water over it. When you wipe the surface with paper towel, it will not be wipe off or came off the paper.

 

[ghwellsjr]

Thanks for the info. However, I should have asked how you can know before you buy it which type it is. For example, on Staples webpage or any of its links, including the links on hp's websites, there is no mention of "swellable". Aside from asking someone who has already done your experiment, how would anyone know that HP's papers are likely to be swellable?

I went back and studied Ilford's pdf and now I can see that they are making a distinction between swellable and nanoporous papers but they warn that the nanoporous papers will fade quickly even without exposure to light unless they are kept under glass. Also, on Staples website, they state that the fade resistance of the HP papers are when they are also protected under glass. If you click on the "Also Consider" link, you will see that Staples has their own brand of paper that looks like it might be a replica of the HP paper, but how can I tell if it is also swellable without buying some and experimenting with it?

So my question is: is there any point in doing a fade test on unprotected nanoporous paper exposed to light when we expect them to fade even in darkness? And do the swellable papers have a similar problem?

 

[mikling]

I think we may be obsessing a bit over the fade issue here.

First, NOT all HP papers are swellable. There are only certain models or even maybe model (singular) which are. The availability of swellable is actually decreasing because of the growth in color pigment ink printers. Pigment ink is not compatible with swellable and there is no need for it as the pigment particles are already encapsulated in resin. So for those who have fade issues (Pro photographers or sellers of prints) they naturally gravitate to pigment ink and the issue of fade goes away and the availability of different papers is much greater. Furthermore, if they favor matte prints, pigment ink is the only solution for durability anyways.

The mention of the type of paper is hardly mentioned on most packages and if you think it was confusing on this board, can you imagine someone not even remotely close to ink and refilling? I'm not even sure a retail store clerk would even know that a distinction exists. So it ends up being a trial and error process for the most part. Many consumers actually do not want this type of paper because it takes too long to dry properly and it instantly runs if water is splashed on it..including bodily fluids such as from speech and sneezes.

Many purchase the Ilford line in larger sizes of letter size and up for display purposes which do not lend themselves for albums., In albums, pharmacist once mentioned that dye prints can last decades. Pharmacist could probably comment on this.

I do believe Ilford is erring on the side of caution in advising that when inkjet prints are displayed, a layer of glass aids immensely in extending durability here. They are also one of the few mfrs to state the composition of the paper as well. This line is possibly targeted at a more selective audience.

 

[martin0reg]

@mikling
agree with your observations, please excuse the offtopic discussion of fading.
But your black&white ink set for canon competes with a carbon/pigment ink set for epson 6 channel printers.
Yours is easier to handle for canon refillers, but a major disadvantage could be fading of dye.
Therefor it would be very interesting how much this ink fades on swellable paper (only few sorts, ilford, hp..) compared to microporous (which is the most used and more universal type of paper)
@ghwells
I am looking forward to your tests of non OEM material
- in a new thread -
And yes there are two different fadings: from light (UV) and from air (ozon).
But as all results in fading colors, the main thing for comparison ist to put the test objects (e.g. swellable - microporous - different inks ...) in the same condition (e.g. direct sunlight - under glass - in an album ...).