Refill 3rd Party Ink Cartridges? (Pro 100S)

[kdsdata]

Hi photo, both of my orders of OEM CLI-42 carts from Octo came with one CLI-8. I actually didn't know that it was meant for "practice".

Since I have entered the refill period of my life, I have gotten to like the top fill method better. Three things I like to pass on.

First, there is (was) one important difference, I have learned, between Octo and Precision. The ink bottles in the Octo kit came with caps that have long needles that you use for filling. They stay on the caps and are sealed with small rubber caps. They are very practical for refilling carts using the top fill method directly from the ink bottle. There is no need to fill syringes, which can be messy. But those "cap" needles are flat ended, and are not good (sharp) enough for the German fill method.

Second, considering that you (will) have plugs from Octo, do not drill the hole larger in the OEM carts. Just remove the ball with a small screw by "pulling". It will pop out nicely. Don't twist sideways, so you don't damage the hole. That way the Octo plugs push nicely in and out of the hole (repeatedly, that's important too).

With the plugs from Precision I had to drill the hole larger. If you don't finesse the drilling properly, it can leave the hole rough, not nice and smooth. A plug that doesn't sit properly, will allow air leakage, which may/can allow the ink to prematurely drain out through the print head. Maybe the drilling is not the case anymore, but I can't say. So it's something to consider.

With the long Octo fill needles I got so cocky that it would work without drips or spills that I didn't even use gloves the last time. Yeah, I live on the edge But notice I didn't mention success. However, there were no spills, just small squeezie leaks.

Third, don't get tempted to fill the cart to the max. That invites drip, or squeeze leakages when the cart is installed in the printed. Any minute pressure on cart sides with absolute full liquids will cause that. When you have gotten better at refilling, meaning your learn where to put your fingers for every little purpose, it becomes so easy that a little air space on top seems like a good investment. Although it mean replacing refills more often, it becomes a "much" cleaner process.

Lastly, I like having a second set of carts. That way on a swap the print head is exposed to dry air as short as possible. Wish you good success.

 

[mikling]

First
The not knowing will think those plugs that slip on are easier. There is a serious downside, if you don't realize.
First, the built in hole tunnel in the Canon cartridge is tapered. That means that there is an inherent vector force when a plug is put in to have the plug slip back off. My low clearance plugs also fit with no modifications as well but this I have carefully evaluated and for the sake of long term reliability elected not to even allow this. When ink is on the surface of the tunnel, the friction will be reduced and potential slippage is real.

Second. the Precision plugs again to non knowing do not fit onto the tunnel. You are incorrect in this thought again,. When they are fitted they go beyond the conical tapered tunnel for a reason. Beyond the tunnel, the edge of the tunnel acts as a constriction. Like a cinching effect. this means that the seal will be proper and this constriction waist belt tightened effect stops the plug from ever slipping out.

There is FAR more engineering thought that went into the engineering choice of these simple things. Why? I am a degreed Mechanical Engineer of a reputable university in Canada. Nothing more needs to be said.

The conclusions you had reached needs to be rethought and revised.

 

[kdsdata]

Hi All. I don't want to speak against any advice regarding the Yellow carts. But (unfortunately there is always a but) I have had no bad results. At least not until now. There may however be good reasons.

One, I live in a city at higher elevation. Our house sits at 4,200ft, and sort of mid continent. That mean it's alway very dry.

The other reason may be the "slow" process I used for flushing. Because I experienced the Jello problem during my initial refill (due to not paying much earlier attention to all the good advice) I had purchased 3rd party carts to install in the printer. Therefore I had time for a new arrangement. That involved new refill equipment and supplies. And this involved flushing. But I had time, and simply no need to rush.

When I flushed the OEM carts, I not only used "lots" of Windex, but I also flushed over a number of days, and let the Windex filled cart sit overnight(s). Then repeated the flushing with water over a number of days/nights. To start the drying, I used the paper and rubber band method, together with syringes for about a week to just blow air through the carts. Lastly I was able to let the carts dry for month (no plugs in hole). That's very effective in Calgary. I started the process early March, spent about 3 weeks flushing, and then was able to dry the carts till mid-Oct, when I needed the first set for a swap.

That's why I am reporting good results, even for the yellow CLI-42. But please don't discount any of the other advice. The advice is really good, and was my starting point. So I too want to add my thanks to the earlier contributors. It is clear they all speak from experience. So please, heed their advice. Unless you want to live on the edge like me

 

[stratman]

both of my orders of OEM CLI-42 carts from Octo came with one CLI-8. I actually didn't know that it was meant for "practice".

They are not according to Octoink:

"All refill bundles and any orders for CLI-42Y empty cartridges are automatically supplied with a CLI-8Y as a surrogate which can (once chips are swapped) used as a replacement for the CLI-42Y and refilled without needing to worry about potential yellow jello or similar issues.


Any customers who have purchased a Pro-100 refill bundle or empty CLI-42Y cartridge (or set containing same) that have not already received a CLI-8Y with their order can contact us with their order reference and we will forward a CLI-8Y cartridge (free of charge)."

http://www.octoink.co.uk/kb/questions/186/CLI-42Y+(Yellow)+Cartridge+-+Special+Considerations

But those "cap" needles are flat ended, and are not good (sharp) enough for the German fill method.

This is a common fallacy on the forum. I, and others including the refill king Jimbo123, have used blunt-tipped needles since refill day one for years with the same cartridges.

With the long Octo fill needles I got so cocky that it would work without drips or spills that I didn't even use gloves the last time.

Agree! Squeeze bottles with Luer Lock needles in the cap are so much better than syringes. In the early days, you had to order squeeze bottle and caps from another supplier than Precision Colors and Octoink. Eventually both refilling outlets sold their own version.

 

[stratman]

I experienced the Jello problem during my initial refill

What refill ink did you use?

Did the Yello Gello issue happen before refilling because of the flushing or did the issue occur show up after refilling but before flushing?

Happy to hear you have gotten good results!

 

[kdsdata]

I am happy that @stratman and @mikling (and @Hat is probably watching) are here to keep us on the straight.

I was not aware of the design considerations involved in choosing the plugs. Very interesting and certainly should be carefully considered.

The issue with my Yellow Gello issue was before any flushing (didn't even know about "flushing" then) and less related to the ink I used, but more, if not all, with the carts I had. But it really was all my fault. I just got some ink, drilled a hole, and refilled. I didn't even know about the plugs, so I had used tape to cover the hole.

Therefore and herewith I give permission to this site's gurus to smile or even laugh, and unanimously say "could have told you so".

To be fair, for my snafus I shouldn't quote any make of carts, or inks, or suppliers.

Some pitfall I now know, and am glad I joined this forum. It has been a good experience, and good refill results. However, I'll have to keep up my vigilance, so I don't get trapped in pitfall by making assumption, or making loose statements based on my assumptions. So, a thank you to the gurus.

 

[stratman]

The issue with my Yellow Gello issue was before any flushing (didn't even know about "flushing" then) and less related to the ink I used, but more, if not all, with the carts I had.

My understanding of the Yello Gello mess is due to dilution of OEM Canon Yellow ink with water, presumably. This happens if you flush the cartridge with just water, instead of Windex first, or an eventual result from refilling with aftermarket inks (although Octoink ink may or may not be a cause but is being approached as if it will cause Yello Gello).

In your case, since you did not initially flush before the problem appeared, the issue of Yello Gello would be caused by refilling and not the cartridge. Other issues besides the Yello Gello can cause poor ink flow through the sponged side, but there is not enough information to definitively say what. Could be drying out of ink in the sponge over time causing flow issues. This is why the recommendation is to refill when the spongeless side is ~ empty but the sponged side remains ~full.

What refill ink were you using?

 

[kdsdata]

So far I have used only the top fill method. Yes, the Yello Gello was pretty well due to refilling, but mainly because I simply investigated "nothing" until I actually had the problem. It was ink to ink incombatibiity. But I can't claim incompatibility, because if I had studied the sources I would have seen all the correct warnings. I can however attest that the warning are correct.

That's why I give so much credit to the gurus herin, and on youtube. From the time I looked at all the good advice thing started to go the correct way, although I may have some issues lurking, regarding the plugs. Following @mikling's advice, I will revisit the plug issue, but I will need to spend some time to revise my understanding.

 

[Photographic Memory]

Please read my other thread I just created, I seem to have inadvertently kicked in the Yellow Gello, on my CLI-525 ix6550, not by the 3rd Party Inks I have been using for almost a year, but with water alone through unclogging the Cyan channel with was blocked and was the reason I looked into getting this new Pro-100.

 

[Photographic Memory]

It doesn't rain, it pours they say... One minute (months in fact) everything is great, happily printing away. The next minute I am intently researching Refilling Ink for the first time on a new Printer (which in itself has two options - 'Top Fill' and 'German Method' whilst at the exact same time studying how to unclog Printheads.
The past week or so has been consuming and tonight it has just been overwhelming, finally coming to the conclusion I have contracted Yellow Jello-itus, thankfully not on my new Printer, but the one it is replacing.
I need to sleep, been up most nights reading 20+ page threads on here from start to finish I have finally lost concentration.
This isn't a negative "dig", quite the contrary, it's just my human limitations have been reached. For the time being. Now I need to rest. And digest.

This forum is a wealth of information. But it has overloaded me.

My thanks go out to all! Good night.