Printheads & Inks

[jessarooy2k]

Hey gang,

I've been wrestling this question long enough now. Mike (Precision Inks) has been outstanding in helping with his expertise, but I'm afraid I've worn him thin too, lol. So I'll just throw this out there for some of you other "printer guru's" or else I'll be in the afterlife before making a decision.
1st, I print at leisure, not everyday. Having read some articles in the forum, I should stick with dye inks to avoid head clogging. Then there's the fading issue with "dye" inks. I want my prints to last, of course...especially if I find a market for them and just for posterity. But I want my cake and "eat it too" so to speak. Spraying each print over 11X8.5in with a good UV spray seems suitable, albeit a little pricey. It appears that all Canon wide format printers use pigment inks!? And the Epson R1400 (according to Mike) can accommodate both ink types? Scalability is always nice, but then is quality sacrificed? Is an Epson R1800/1900 as scalable as the R1400? Do I need to have spare or pre-cleaned ink heads around for pigment ink printers??? You know, for those one or two week off periods? I have an HP 309g that has an easily removable ink head; the four inks that do all the color photo work are "dye" ink and the remaining text ink is "pigment black"......I printed color photos everyday for over a week without printing one single document. When I did go to print a document, I got a lot of print action but not one word of text. I sense a lot of chuckling out there. After a little nervousness and a few program suggestions and head cleanings I finally got a nice pretty print. Was I lucky, or is this normal, I ask because I just installed a CISS? SO HERE IS MY PLITE....A WIDE FORMAT PRINTER THAT WILL GIVE ME EXCELLENT PHOTOS BUT NOT DRIVE ME INTO THE POOR HOUSE, OR INSANITY! Or, what should one do to keep a print head safe whether dye or pigment based during those "off times"????

jessarooy2k

 

[siusiuenen]

Printing a nozzle check everyday it may help. That's what i did when i had epson printer. There's a little program that help you to printer nozzle check everyday but i cannot recall where i download it.

 

[d1hamby]

There are inkjet papers that can take a higher volume of ink, which in turn makes it less likely to fade. If I want a print to last a long time I use a synthetic tear resistant weatherproof paper. This is almost indestructible.

 

[mikling]

Here's the deal. The Epson Stylus Photo 1400 can do dye and unofficially pigment ( for marketing reasons) So you can use dye for everyday tasks and then when you want to print something permanent then switch to pigment by installing a set of pigment carts. Clogging is no longer an issue with this generation of printer.

The R800/1800 head designs are much more sensitive to trapping air within the head and don't have the ability to clear bubbles effectively. Their head design is one generation behind the 1400. Given a choice between the two, I'd take the 1400 in a heartbeat if I did not do a lot of Matte printing. So you know your needs and can make that choice. The R1900 head is the same generation as the SP1400. Furthermore, the chip contact design of the R800/1800 is not as reliable as the SP1400.

Now at these prices, wide carriage desktop printing is seriously affordable now.
visit epson.com at the clearance center.

Refurbs for $161 with free shipping and you get an Epson warranty. These printers can also use a CISS but once you install a CISS then the versatility of the printer, that is the ability to switch from color dye ink, to archival pigment ink and Black and White inksets is lost. The ink channels on these heads clear and prime really easily so switching between inks is not a problem either.

With the SP 1400 printing a nozzle check everyday is no longer required. With the new generation of printers this Epson ritual is no longer required and can now be put to rest. Of course if you wish to do so, you can. It's hard to break a habit.

The build quality is good with an extremely large diameter carriage rod and a chassis that is quite heavy and feels solid. It was meant to be a $300-400 printer and at these prices, are quite good buys.

I suspect the SP 1400 will likely be superseded by a new model later this year. I also suspect that it will use the head configuration that the Artisan 700/800/710/810 uses. Epson has superior color performance waiting to be released to wide carriage desktops. It's simply a question of when.

See this http://www.nifty-stuff.com/forum/viewtopic.php?id=5173

 

[ghwellsjr]

It appears that all Canon wide format printers use pigment inks!?

I don't know about the current crop of Canon printers, but the older ones that had chipless cartridges were exclusively dye ink printers. That would be the i9100 and the i9900. The first one had six dye ink cartridges and the second one had eight.

 

[Tin Ho]

The R800/1800 head designs are much more sensitive to trapping air within the head and don't have the ability to clear bubbles effectively. Their head design is one generation behind the 1400.

With the SP 1400 printing a nozzle check everyday is no longer required. With the new generation of printers this Epson ritual is no longer required and can now be put to rest. Of course if you wish to do so, you can. It's hard to break a habit.

This is very interesting. However, I am skeptical always as a consumer. Is there any official word from Epson or pros on the internet that back up this? Or is it just your opinion? Epson calls the print head DX5, a flashy new term, but is it really new wine or just a new bottle for the wine? These days there are too many new bottles put up for the porposes of marketing hype. I still see the 1400 doing a cleaning cycle each time it is powered up. This is not the case of Canon printers fed with dye inks. Why is the difference still there? I would really appreciate that you cite a source to back up this claim.

 

[Tin Ho]

BTW, does anyone really believe Epson's dye based ink to resist fading for 200 years? I don't. Despite Epson makes such a claim no one will live long enough to sue Epson 200 years later. Epson may not still exist by then.

 

[qwertydude]

I've done some durability tests and can attest that the number one thing affecting print life with dye ink is the paper used, I did a durability test comparing Canon ink to stratitec refill ink, and stratitec isn't even considered a great ink over here. Cheap paper like meritline may look ok but I found in just 2 weeks it faded significantly in ultrabright CA sunlight. Whereas Canon and Kodak paper looked entirely unaffected. Even at 6 months when I ended the test it was only slightly faded on the Canon and Kodak paper the meritline I could practically have printed a new picture on top of the old it was nearly bleached out, surprisingly between Canon oem ink and Stratitec there wasn't any significantly more life between them, apparently all the hype with the life of ink is just advertising or that a decent ink will last a long time, I tend to think a little of both. Probably the best life was on HP paper but I didn't like HP paper cause it's not waterproof since it is swellable paper.

 

[mikling]

My source is my actual use. Whatever Epson claims, my preference for real permanence is pigment ink. Canon as well as Epson can make all the claims in the world about Chromalife etc and Claria. My confidence is strictly with pigment when it come to permanence. To get color pigment printing on a Canon pigment in a 13" wide format cannot be accomplished for $161. Try multiple of that.

Rather than joining in a lot of the internet banter, the real proof of the pudding is to acquire BOTH brands in question and test them properly yourself and then make comments. Using one's long time history of past generations to comment on current models is highly flawed. I ahve invested many days of profiling and tinting inks and about about 150 sheets of letter sized paper to come to these conclusions.

How do I come to the conclusion that the current printheads do not have a clogging issue. Well the amount of cartridge changes involved in tuning an inkset and profiling would number over hundreds. Throughout that period no clogs nor air entrapment issues were encountered.

I have an Epson R260 with one of the first DX5 heads on a CISS for over a year. How many head cleans required in that period? a big donut.

BTW on wider photoprinters, the ink useage issue is moot. Why, If you really have used an i9900 or Pro9000 you will note that it actually primes the head each time it starts up and is critical to these printers. When someone starts up a wider sized printer, photoprinting ensues. The print itself will consume more ink than the prime cycles. As a result the percentage of wasted ink on a wider printer is far smaller than on printers meant for text printing.

Again, get a hold of comparative printers, custom profile each and then assess the images.