lost Magenta

[member 5159]

This is nozzle check no 7 changed carts had head out cleaned in Window cleaner (Morrison's) absolutely nothing HEAD BLOWN? I tried feeding cleaning fluid down a needle scabbard (end cut off perfect fit) and it seemed to go down at a steady rate.

I have recently changed to Freedom filling also this was an OEM cart like most of mine from Octoink washed it out before filling (new batch). Most of my printing is web pages loaded loads this past week re problems with Windows update not configuring and they all appeared normal. However yesterday evening I tried to print plain paper print of some copper foliage and it turned out all green which I knew meant the problem was back.

Previously some of the Magenta was showing not now. My upload also seems faint hope you can see enough. Any ideas?

 

[PeterBJ]

You didn't mention what printer and cartridges you are having problems with, but I guess that the cartridges are of the PGI-520/CLI-521 or PGI-525/CLI-526 type?

I have noticed more threads about these cartridges with inkflow problems than with the older transparent cartridges, especially when they are refilled using the "German" method.

Your printhead could have failed electrically, but in that case the fault often affects the PGBK or Dye nozzles in a way that shows exactly half of a printed band faulty, like a picket fence pattern in PGBK or half of a dye band missing or significantly lighter than the other half. Another symptom of electrical printhead failure is either PGBK or the dye bands missing completely.

So I think you have a magenta inkflow problem. This could be caused by either the cartridge or the fine passages in the upper part of the printhead being clogged.

Your test has shown that the printhead is not clogged in magenta. It it not recommended to pressurize the printhead, so hopefully this test has not damaged the printhead.

I recommend buying a new OEM magenta cartridge and trying printing with that. If magenta now prints OK you know that the magenta cartridge(s) is/are faulty. Purging and drying of the cartridge(s) could then bring it/them back to working order. If a new magenta cartridge doesn't print properly, probably the printhead and/or the logic board is defective.

You could also do some inkflow tests of the cartridges, comparing a working cartridge like cyan to the suspect magenta. Touch a piece of kitchen paper to the ink outlets of the two cartridges and notice how quickly the ink wicks into the paper. Also hold the cartridges over a sink and notice how hard you have to blow into the vent before a drop of ink leaves the ink outlet. I have had failed cartridges that were very difficult to blow ink out of.

See this thread for an inkflow problem I had, especially note the the posts that mention sponge displacement and an air-lock: http://www.nifty-stuff.com/forum/viewtopic.php?id=7744

I have a suspicion, but no evidence yet, that the newer windowed and opaque cartridges are more fragile than the older transparent cartridges, and that top filling may be the least damaging way to refill the new cartridges. If I remember correctly ThrillaMozilla reported sponge displacement problems with the opaque HP 564 XL cartridges that were refilled using the Freedom method. The cure is to tap the cartridge hard against a table with the ink ink outlet facing down and protected by a storage clip or similar.

 

[The Hat]

Looking at your nozzle check I have to say its a cartridge problem
but until you fix your problem dont under any circumstances do ant printing other than nozzle checks.

The air maze in your cart could be partially blocked or as mentioned you could have
a sponge separation problem, and tapping the cartridge can cure that.

Try dribbling a little water on the air maze and then blowing into it,
you should then see some ink coming out of the bottom outlet.

If you have a little alcohol squirt about one ml into the outlet (turn the cartridge upside first)
then pop the cart back into the printer do a normal head clean and then a nozzle check,
this should get thing working again for you.

Another quick solution would be to put a magenta chip onto your spare yellow cartridge
drop that into the printer then do a normal head clean and try a few nozzles checks..

 

[ThrillaMozilla]

If I remember correctly ThrillaMozilla reported sponge displacement problems with the opaque HP 564 XL cartridges that were refilled using the Freedom method. The cure is to tap the cartridge hard against a table with the ink ink outlet facing down and protected by a storage clip or similar.

Correct. The thread is here. I'm afraid to leave the storage clip on, though, for fear of damaging either the port or the clip. What I do is to hold a strip of wood on the bottom, to protect the port. But whatever method works for you.

The cartridge had an unknown history, and was dried out when I got it. I don't know that the problem was caused by the Freedom Method, but it is certainly possible.

For what it's worth, here are my current recommendations on precautions to take with Freedom Filling.

Let us know how this works for you.

 

[member 5159]

I should have said Canon Pixma MP620. I have tried 2 different carts, I have tried dribbling ink onto outlet and I have blown through vent into sink and got ink out of each cart. I cart Freedom the 2nd Top fill with low profile plug plus tape. I will certainly look carefully take on board everybody's suggestions although it probably would be unwise to print them out, will save for now.

At least you do not think the head has blown. Because I was getting cleaning fluid draining steadily through the magenta input I thought that meant IT WAS NOT BLOCKED which in a way is correct as you think it is a cart problem.

Thanks all

 

[member 5159]

PeterBj note your advice have ordered an OEM. I tried blowing through air vents ther Freedom one needed a lot of pressure the topfill one somewhat less but a Cyan one filled with water passed fluid with much less effort. However I do not know the relative viscocity between water and ink. I have used the Freedom jig to extract the ink and flush the Freedom cart, the sponge is now white but there is a small pink blush apposite the M on the label. This probably indicates that ink had penentrated that area.

I have tried The Hat water and isopropanol trick but so far no improvement. When you suggest switching a Magenta chip to a yellow cart I assume this will then put yellow ink through the Magenta channel and prove it works? thats if I have understood correctly. What about using an empty cart with cleaner in to see if fluid gets on the paper?.

Will give carts a good tap as suggested by ThrillaMozilla. Visual inspection with an eyeglass looks as though the output filter has'nt moved not sure about internally though. I thought the Freedom method would be great but was concerned that ink could get in the maze, also once the first pull goes in every subsequent pull is pulling some ink and AIR out before it goes back in again causing a lot of foam. I agree about 3/4 pulls for a full cart. I am now thinking of just one pull which in effect what the commercial kit was achieving and see if that prints. I have had the opposite effect to yourself PGBK with their larger capacity are more difficult I did wonder about an 100ml syringe whereas the C/Y/M/BK have been OK.

Anyway see what happens when I get a new cart either sucess or failure. This printer has been used regularly but lightly for less than 2 years so I would hope the Head is not gone.

 

[ThrillaMozilla]

If you use Freedom Filling, I really don't think cartridges should ever need to be flushed unless the cartridge has dried out. The new ink WILL get in there and dissolve any minute residue that could be there. I really don't like the idea of leaving any purging fluid in there, though. If I have to purge, I withdraw ink from the sponge and recharge it a second time.

 

[PeterBJ]

barfl2 wrote:

...I tried blowing through air vents ther Freedom one needed a lot of pressure the topfill one somewhat less but a Cyan one filled with water passed fluid with much less effort. However I do not know the relative viscocity between water and ink...

This clearly indicates an inkflow problem with the magenta cartridge. I also have done this test both with cartridges filled with ink and with water. I found that ink or water doesn't make much difference when doing this test. Purging and/or tapping the cartridge may bring it back to work.

See this thread, even if the topic is German refill problems, some problems are the same: http://www.nifty-stuff.com/forum/viewtopic.php?id=8208&p=1 and note this post: http://www.nifty-stuff.com/forum/viewtopic.php?pid=59280#p59280 for my problems with the PGI-520/CLI-521 cartridges.

I think think the Freedom refill method works best with a transparent cartridge, and the alternate flow of ink in and out of the cartridge might shift the position of the sponges. The German refill method also has its problems with the newer cartridges, so I recommend, that after having restored your cartridges to working order, you give the topfill method a try. When using the topfill method a perfect seal of the ink chamber is important. I recommend the use of the low profile plugs plus alumin(i)um tape from Octoink UK. I also think their cartridge storage clips are more convenient to use than the original orange clips attached with rubber bands, when topfilling a cartridge.

When you receive your new OEM magenta cartridge, you could try the "blow into the vent test" with this cartridge, to get a feel of how hard you need to blow into a cartridge, that is in perfect working order, to expel a drop of ink.

 

[ThrillaMozilla]

There are reports of shifting the sponge also with the German method. And then there are reports of people purging all the time. Flow problems do not seem to be specific to one method or another.

Difficulty in blowing ink from a cartridge does indicate a flow problem. It is important to note, however, blowing ink out does normally get harder when the cartridge is no longer full.

Finally, a perfect seal over the ink chamber is not just important. It's absolutely essential.

 

[The Hat]

Finally, a perfect seal over the ink chamber is not just important. It's absolutely essential.

It's absolutely 100% essential.