HP C309a continuing affairs - Magenta starvation

[nerdful1]

I'm back after waiting to spend more on this thing, or switch to Canon for future solution and just use up my pints of MIS ink for pretty graphs rather than pictures, then toss the thing.

I'm looking for some guidance to maximize information to the group and minimize further wallet attacks.

I posted a lot of other problems on this bumpy road, but the magenta has never worked right since starting the repair/refill saga.

After learning the printhead enough, and ways to unclog or clean it, I replaced it with a new one from Amazon.

It worked fine except for the magenta. I sent it back under warranty for another rather than risk voiding its warranty by manual cleaning, etc. It was brand new anyway, so it should have worked.

The replacement is the same way, so the original and two replacements make it look like it is not the head to blame.

So, Using the MIS inksupply.com cartridge, and a non XL cart that had been refilled by Cartridge World, then by me several times with MIS ink , (not counting the leak and cross contamination problems of before), I get what you see here.

I was wondering if maybe the viscosity of the MIS ink is wrong, or other problems.

I just bought for $18.00 an official HP 564XL brand new genuine cartridge. Should I drill it and sample ink for viscosity testing? Any other tests to compare with my pints of MIS inks?

I thought I'd ask before unsealing it.

Also, I bought a full XL set of the other colors as an investment hoping I'd be refilling them in the future. Should I put the whole set in or just the magenta?

At the moment I have recently filled the set in the unit which consists of MIS clear refillables, and a mix of XL and non XL oem carts.

This is where the printout tests I uploaded come from.

If you look closely, it is interesting how the ink seems to starve exactly from page to page. One page was printed from a 24 hour rest, the second one right after. It seems it can't keep up above a certain ink flow rate. The light magenta bar looks fine, for example.

I'm afraid of printing purge pages due to ink starving completely and possibly burning out the head.

After this is solved, I'll post my colostomy waste bottle and battery location pictures for the forum.

Thanks!

P.S. Not sure how to post pictures here yet, will look now...

 

[ThrillaMozilla]

Should I drill it and sample ink for viscosity testing?

Gosh, no. You can get a little ink out just by blowing on the vent at the top of the cartridge.

It seems it can't keep up above a certain ink flow rate. The light magenta bar looks fine, for example.

If you haven't done so, take a look at my thread here: http://www.nifty-stuff.com/forum/viewtopic.php?id=7009 . I don't have a definitive answer for my magenta cartridge, but one of the cartridges had a gap between the sponge and the outlet filter. I knocked it back into position (being careful not to dent the outlet and spoil the seal with the print head).

A new cartridge or two solved the problem. I did have good luck finally, by vacuum (Freedom) filling, but even vacuum filling was problematical at first. The problem may just have been the one set of used cartridges with an unknown history.

 

[nerdful1]

Thanks.

The magenta problem was on two if not three carts. I had also checked the contact to the head strainers many times in the past.

Ok, I'll put in the new one and run the HP quality check at first to see if it purges the magenta and begins working, then run the head clean if not.

If it starts working perfectly, then it has to be the MIS ink, and I'll try to test the hp and MIS ink for tension and viscosity as described elswhere here.

If all else fails, I'll start the yard sale season looking for Canons...

 

[ThrillaMozilla]

If it starts working perfectly, then it has to be the MIS ink...

...or the cartridge or the way it was filled. Ink starvation is a common problem in this forum, and people have spent a lot of time mucking around with cartridges. There are several things that can go wrong with them, such as too much air in the sponge, or perhaps some old dried ink, or the sponge not in contact with the outlet.

It could also be the ink too. I'm not 100% sure that wasn't my problem either. It's hard to know without checking. If you do test it the results will be interesting. Let us know.

By the way, where do you get MIS ink for HP564? I wasn't aware that they sold it.

 

[nerdful1]

I went to MIS because In the beginning I was researching pro photographer forums to look at their ink solutions (pun intended).

On the Luminous Landscape site, I saw reference to complete gray scale ink sets by MIS (now inksupply.com) and went there. I was planning on buying a cis after trying their inks, but never got that far. I thought they had a CIS for the 309a, but I don't see it now.

Anyway I have pint bottles of ink from them for it, a Deskjet 720, and a Deskjet 920C. The black ink is common among them. Maybe if I give up on the 309a, the colors will work ok for non-photo graphs and documents on the old ones.

I use Linux mostly, so the old printers are well supported. I use Windows 7 when doing any tests on the c309a so as to not throw in more variables.

I am thinking now of capping my present carts, and installing the full HP set in the unit. Then I can print out a bunch of photos on the ink I just payed through the nose (or other orifice) for.

I'll try to sample the HP inks too for the group: Soda straw and drop count checks.

The only regret is I did not buy a black cart, just the photo gray.

 

[nerdful1]

An update to my c309a problems.

I purchased cyan, magenta, yellow, and photo gray OEM xl carts.

I replaced only the magenta cart, and now it works perfectly with the official HP ink.

This points to the MIS ink being the problem as I had the magenta problem on 3 print heads with the MIS now inksupply.com inks, and none with the oem ink.

I am going to post for help in measuring the magenta ink tension and/or viscosity using info from here: http://www.nifty-stuff.com/forum/viewtopic.php?pid=1010.

Update: Even though I had been running the printer quality check at least once a day, and occasional color printing (no photos, as I want to measure the magenta ink before it runs down), the Yellow cart (MIS refillable with the rubber plug) started to malfunction.

Filled at same time as all the other carts a week or two ago, it showed about half full in the auxiliary tank.

It would print at the start of the printer quality bar, then go to white.

What amazes me is the exact repeat test patterns as it starves or whatever.

From reading elsewhere about maybe sponge not mating with output orifice pad, I whacked it on the countertop. Then it started bubbling from the sponge chamber to the tank, until the tank fully drained into the absorbing sponge.

Anyway, not to post for help in another topic in measuring my tiny amount of expensive ink....

Thanks.

P.S. I don't know what support I may get from MIS inksupply. I sure would have no problems if they sent me some new samples to try.

I had trusted them to buy pints from them for all my printers.

 

[ThrillaMozilla]

Filled at same time as all the other carts a week or two ago, it showed about half full in the auxiliary tank.

It would print at the start of the printer quality bar, then go to white.

What amazes me is the exact repeat test patterns as it starves or whatever.

From reading elsewhere about maybe sponge not mating with output orifice pad, I whacked it on the countertop. Then it started bubbling from the sponge chamber to the tank, until the tank fully drained into the absorbing sponge.

Great! You caught it in the act of air-locking. This is a nice proof that this actually happens.

There's a bubble between the two chambers. Air is supposed to bubble into the ink chamber as ink passes the other way through the same hole. It's supposed to wick onto the sponge, but sometimes a bubble blocks the ink, and that's where it sits.

When I refill, as a last step, I now hold the cartridge with the ink chamber up, and tap the cartridge to eliminate any bubble that might be there. My cartridges are opaque, but I posted a radiograph that shows a bubble between chambers. Be very careful when you whack or tap cartridges, that you do not dent the outlet. The seal with the print head is critical, and a dent would probably ruin the cartridge.

I had exactly the same symptoms. There's more to this than there appears at first. There are several possible reasons for starvation:
1. A new, dry sponge will not soak up ink. It is suspected that the factory vacuum fills.

2. The sponge gets air in it when it empties. The air will remain in the sponge and retard flow. Both of these are actually mentioned in a Canon patent. (HP uses the Canon system.)

3. Thickened ink or solid residue from pigment ink can gunk up the sponge.

4. Air lock. That's what you had.

5. The sponge must make good contact with the outlet filter, or else flow from the cartridge will be limited.

6. The cartridge outlet filter must make good contact with the print head inlet. Messing with the seals on the head (changing them, adding an additional washer, etc.) can interfere with good contact.

7. A damaged outlet port could interfere with the seal.

8. I suppose the seal could wear out, the filter could move in the cartridge, etc.

9. The ink could have the wrong viscosity or surface tension. This could be by design, or because of evaporation.

In my case, I have observed #5 and possibly #4. I am also unsure whether I adequately prepared some used cartridges I used for experimentation. In fact, I strongly suspect that as part of the problem.