How to reach ink waste tank? /Dismantle i960

[Soporose]

Soporose,... I guess that the i865 is just the European version of the i860. Yes, one of the manuals is for the i860 series. It is only slightly different than the i560, i960 series. I see that you purchased the Service Manual and can see that while it does have good information, it is no where near enough to allow anyone to service the machine.

I can't believe that you have gone through 3 printheads. There is something else wrong. I am currently working on the complete removal, and cleaning of the Purge Unit. This is what really keeps the printhead working. If the purge unit is not working right, it will clog up the printhead so bad you won't be able to use it for anything. The other key thing is knowing how to clean your printheads. Tell me more about what you have done to your printer and maybe we can stop some of this bleeding.

Hi Trigger.

I wanted to get the printer back and run it for a bit before responding, then of course other jobs took precedence. Anyway...

Well, it was another head replacement - free because it was still under warranty from the previous one. The previous one should have been free too but they used the "3rd party ink" excuse to invalidate the warranty.

When they again wouldn't allow me to talk directly to the tech to find out why so many head replacements, I jumped up and down and caused a scene and the owner of the business came into it. He tried explaining that it was all because of 3rd party inks, viscosity this and microns that. I'm sure he was just parroting the party line from Canon and trying to confuse this dumb-ass with science. I didn't tell him I'd been in the IT business for almost three decades, but I did make it clear I wasn't convinced. Some of the points I made:

1. Its an indisputable fact that third-party inks are used in enormous quantities globally, yet after extensive research I couldnt find wide reports of repeated short-term head failures.

2. When print head life is quoted at 10,000 pages of colour printing, repeated failures of the print head in the same unit (after only a fraction of that through-put) perhaps deserve deeper investigation than just accepting the obvious cause - which to them is always 3rd party inks. Thanks to your tip I also put in that I knew that if the purge unit wasn't working correctly it could clog the print-head. As a result the job sheet read: "Replaced purge unit to verify poor print fault - no change to print quality (so replaced printhead)".

So I must ask: Will replacing the purge unit bring a clogged head good, or is the damage already done?

This whole 3rd party inks defense smells of cop-out to me, an excuse to charge rather than replace for free if under warranty. Do you think there is any validity in that position?

I'd like to know more about your reference: "The other key thing is knowing how to clean your printheads".

BTW, is there a way I can completely erase the user data from the EPROM before taking it to a service center, so they can't read history, throughput, etc.

- Billy

 

[Trigger 37]

Soporose, Wow,... that is a lot of smoke in that note. Let's start with the last question. The answer is "Yes", when you clear the EEprom, it wipes out any evidence of what the print has done,.. that is for all Non-Chipped printers. The chipped carts can't be erased. They contain the data that you "REfilled them" They have no clue what kind of ink, but since Canon does not sell bulk ink, they have to know you used someone elses ink. YOU BAD BAD CRIMINAL,...HOW COULD YOU DO THAT,...THEN YOU SHALL HAVE NO WARRANTY.

I haven't tried to reset the EEprom in my iP6600d, I don't want to do that yet. Maybe someone on the forum that has will help out with that answer. I know for sure about most all other Canon printers as I've done it on them. They even tell you in the manual that, "when you reset the EEprom, the entire content is cleared (except the following items) USB-S/N, Waste Ink Amount.

Well I just checked my iP6600D Service Manual and it reset everything except;

USB Serial Number
Destination (i.e. US or Japan or EU)
Waste Ink Counter
CD/DVD settings.

So there is your answer,.. and here is how to defeat the whole Warranty thing. Keep a set of Canon ink
tanks in reserve. Yes it costs some $$$. Refill a different set. If you have to take the printer in for any warranty service condition,... reset the EEprom, replace the Canon ink tanks, initialize the items that are required, like country code,..(all of these are explained for the service personnel in the SM), and take the unit in for service. If they ask how it got reset,... you were trying to clear the error and tried some suggestions you saw on the internet. The only place where the "Refilled notice is located" is in the EEprom chip on the front of the ink tanks you have refilled.

As to the question of replacing the Purge unit. If a printhead goes bad, it won't come back. But the issue is did it really go back or was it just really clogged very bad? I can't believe you are using such terrible ink that it is clogging the printhead, unless you are putting some cheap Pigmented ink into the new Canon Carts. These are all "DYE" ink, that really don't clog that bad. You really have to abuse the printer for a long period to get it to clog. I think there is something else wrong. The Purge unit is the guy that sucks the ink out of the carts and if it is bad, you can't clean the printhead while they are in the printer. The cleaning is done by the purge unit.

So here is the question,... when you left the service center, they gave you a new printhead, but did they make you buy new Canon ink carts, or did they give you new ink carts, or did they let you leave the store with no ink carts???? If they are accusing you of using bad ink, I would think they would insist that you show them original Canon ink carts, that have not been refilled. How did you get around that one???

 

[Soporose]

Trigger, I don't refill cartridges - wouldn't know how. And anyway I'm happy with the price of the 3rd party cartridges I buy. And as you know these i865 cartridges aren't chipped.

The previous time (the service BEFORE the last one, which was also a head replacement) I purchased a full set (5) of Canon inks from the service agent so they would "know" (???) I was using genuine inks, and thus couldn't knock me back on the 3 months warranty on the head replacement, if there is a next time.

You see, it was the receptionist (!!!) at the service place who whispered to me "If you put Canon inks in before bringing it back he can't tell the difference." Very nice elderly lady who I assume is sick of seeing customers ripped off with warranty refusals over "non-genuine inks". Or maybe it was my rugged manly visage that took her fancy...

Anyway, I didn't install the Canon inks when I got the printer back last time - I again used the 3rd party "Bontex" inks I buy from my local Post Office at one-third the price of Canon brand - but I put a fresh set in, just in case.

When problems surfaced again after only a fortnight (that's when I first posted here) I replaced the "Bontex" inks with Canon cartridges and took the i865 back to the service centre again. Apparently due to my ranting they first tried a replacement purge unit, which didn't work, so a new head and my own Canon inks reinstalled.

My only reason for wanting to clear the EEPROM history is that the tech wrote the current page-count on the service docket. If there's a next time I don't want them querying the number of pages I seem to be getting out of the one set of Canon inks. I wouldn't be surprised if the tech put an inconspicuous mark on the cartridges to see if the same ones come back. Hey, it's not paranoia if they really are after you!

Looking forward to your thoughts.

BTW, do you know all the button sequences for messing with the EEPROM?

Also, any word on the release of your manuals? Count me in as a definite buyer.

 

[wilca]

And my dear i560 is dead. Then it was alive again the day after. Then dead again. The fuse looks ok. I don't want any other printer. This is the one. Please help me.

/Wilca

 

[Trigger 37]

Soporose,... Glad to hear you were given the correct information about putting back the Canon ink carts. It is really strange the problem you are having with your i865. That printer is just like any of the i Series printers from Canon, i 550, i560, i850, i860, i950, i960,... etc. IF I read you post correctly, each time you've taken it in to repair, it has ended up to be a bad printhead,.. and they replaced it and gave you the printer back. They got mad because they know you are using other vendor ink and they don't want to give away their maintenance time and parts for free. It is beginning to sound like there may be something wrong with your logic card, if you are really killing prinheads like that. The only three things I could think of are 3 bad heads in a row (unless this shop is really buying 2nd hand printheads that are really just used heads and not new ones), or the Purge unit was really bad and not sucking sufficient ink to keep the printhead clean,... and finally,... the ink you are using is really junk. I can't tell the difference from here.

As far as the codes to reset the EEprom,... those have been posted by all kinds of people in many different places. I think it is, 1. Go into Service Mode. 2. Push the Resume buttom 3 times and then the power button. It will do some flashing but should come back to solid green and you will still be in the Service Mode. 3. Press the Resume button 2 times and then the power button. This will force the print out of the EEprom data so you can see that you've not only reset the page counts but most everything else. It will not have reset the waste ink count. That is a different code. By the way. I would suggest that before you reset the EEprom, go ahead and print out the data first, so you can see what it is, then do the reset and print it again.

I finished section 4.5 tonight on my manual. That is the printer disassembly and Waste ink Pad cleaning section. Now I have to get that and many other sections converted to PDF files. I'll keep you informed.

 

[Soporose]

Hi Trigger.

I didn't fade away. My life is periods of frantic activity (during which I set everything else aside to focus on the project in hand) separated by periods of relative calm.

Not knowing exactly what "Go into Service Mode" meant, I did some research and this is the note I created for myself as a result re the EEPROM:

--------------------------
Start with the printer OFF
1. Hold down RESUME and then hold down POWER
2. Release RESUME
3. Press RESUME twice, then release POWER
4. Let green light blink until printer stops cycling

Select a function below with RESUME; press POWER to execute the function:

0 presses - green light - Test print (or exit service mode on i960)
1 press - orange light - EEPROM info print (plus grid nozzle diagnostic on i960)
2 presses - green light - EEPROM initialize
3 presses - orange light - Reset waste ink counter
--------------------------

So far the only function I have actually executed is:
1 press - orange light - EEPROM info print

I'm guessing that "EEPROM initialize" means wipe everything back to Day One status, and I don't want to do that just yet.

However...

I doubt I'll persevere with this thing much longer. Already, just a month after previous head replacement, "Print Quality: Standard" has degenerated slightly. I'm now doing all my printing on "Print Quality: High", which is admittedly very good.

I would buy another Canon, as this one served me well for a few years before all this stuff started happening. However the cost of genuine Canon consumables is very high, plus I'm very reluctant to get into chipped ink tanks.

- Billy

 

[Trigger 37]

Soporose,... I just checked my i860 Service manual and the data does not match what you have printed. I see you mentioned the i960 but you have an i865 which is the European version of the i860. Here are the correct functions for the i860;

0=exit the Service Mode by turning power off.
1=Service Test Print. This print shows the many different alignment checks for service techs.
2=Print of eeprom data
3=Initialize eeprom data
4=Waste Ink Counter reset
5estination Settings
6=Printhead Deep Cleaning
.....

At least you should do number 1 & 2 just to see the data. If your printer is continuing to fade to poor quality, I think it is being starved of ink, and this is caused by bad ink carts. If you are refilling them, then something is going wrong with your process, or the ink you use. Too many other people have had great luck with these Canon printers.

 

[Soporose]

Trigger, I think I must have been confused when I posted those sequences. Based on your recommendations, here are my most recent results:

--------------------------
Start with the printer OFF
1. Hold down RESUME and then hold down POWER
2. Release RESUME
3. Press RESUME twice, then release POWER
4. Let green light blink until printer stops cycling

Select a function (see below) by pressing RESUME the indicated number of times.
Press POWER to execute the selected function:

1 = Service Test Print.
MY RESULT: OK
2 = Print of eeprom data
MY RESULT: OK
3 = Initialize eeprom data
MY RESULT: NOT TRIED
4 = Waste Ink Counter reset
MY RESULT: NOT TRIED
5 = Destination Settings
MY RESULT: DID NOTHING
6 = Printhead Deep Cleaning
MY RESULT: APPEARED TO BE CLEANING
--------------------------

If your printer is continuing to fade to poor quality, I think it is being starved of ink, and this is caused by bad ink carts. If you are refilling them, then something is going wrong with your process, or the ink you use.

I am *NOT* refilling. I am using the same 3rd party Bontex ink carts I have used for over a year without prior problems.

However, I have just noticed something...

I'm referring to those round silvery things (are they screens/filters?) that the feeder hole of each cartridge fits over when the cartridge is inserted into the head carriage. Those "screens" are slightly raised. There is ink pooling in the depression around the Black 3e and Magenta. The others are quite dry.

Any idea what would cause that?

Is it OK to remove the head component and wash it out? With water?

I removed all cartridges and wiped it up as best I could with a tissue but I didn't want to touch the "screens" themselves. Then I just inserted a new Black 3e and performed a deep clean. However "Print Quality: Standard" is still poor, and "Print Quality: High" is still good.

Another question: Can an old cartridge be filled with something (eg. methylated spirits) and used as a cleaner cartridge? Is this a good idea? If so, what's the procedure?

TIA
- Billy

 

[Trigger 37]

Soporose, Well I've been looking at all kinds of ink for Canon printers for about 3 years and I've never heard of Bontex inks. Anyway, if you have not been refilling ink and only using these ink carts,... it is about time you cleaned your printhead. First of all, you don't have to be afraid of the printhead,.. it is not a snake or a crocodile,... and it won't bite you.

If you have been using new compatible ink carts, these should have come with some kind of Cap on the exit hole. Remove all the carts and re-Cap them so they won't leak or dry out. Since your printer is an i865 which should be the same as the i860's that I have, you have 5 ink carts. You have a BCI-6 black Dye ink cart and a BCI-3e Black Pigmented cart, and a BCI-6 Cyan, Magenta, & Yellow carts. If you have been following this forum, you know what kind of problems you can get into if an ink cart does not perform correctly. I haven't found any ink carts that I trust other than Canon. That is why I refill all my Canon carts with the best compatible ink I can buy but I never use anything but original Canon ink Carts. And when one of my Canon ink carts on one of the "XX" printers I have repaired appears bad, I completely "Purge it" and clean it, and get it virtually dry and then I refill it with new ink and it becomes good as new. Then it can be reused for another 10 refill cycles, and possible clean again. Canon has done an outstanding job in engineering these carts and if you treat them right, and keep them in good working condition, they will not fail you.

I have had other vendor ink carts "Leak" into the printhead chamber and flood all the other colors with the wrong ink and contaminate all those colors which basically kills those carts. I wouldn't even try to refill them, as they leaked ink when they were new,... what would they do if I modified them. So I just threw them away. If your printhead is still printing some or all colors, then the problem as I have indicated is either the ink carts you are using, or the purge unit which should be sucking ink out of your carts.

I see that you have not been willing to refill your ink carts, because it is easier to just buy some cheap ones. But what do you do when you get in trouble, you don't know if it is bad ink, bad carts, or a bad printhead, or a bad purge unit, or filled up waste ink pads. Too bad you can't take your printer to a "Jiffy Lube" once every 3000 miles and get it totally serviced for $32.00, but that is what it takes, especially if you are using cheap oil, bad gas, or imitation anti-freeze.

Once you learn to refill the Canon ink carts, and you know you are using the best (but not expensive) ink, and you know how to take care of your printhead, and how to clean and reset your printer, you will find things will get a lot easier to maintain and a lot less expensive.

Since I am working on the Complete Service Manual for the i860 for another person, I will get it ready and put it on Ebay and I'll let you know when it is there. Telling you one piece of the information on this web site would take up way too much space, and it would only be one piece, and no pictures to make it easy. You need all the pieces.

 

[ghwellsjr]

I totally agree with everything Trigger 37 said about Canon vs 3rd-party cartridges.

Here is a thread discussing cleaning solutions:

http://www.nifty-stuff.com/forum/viewtopic.php?id=1480

You can make your own cleaning cartridges or buy them already filled and they are very valuable. My first order of cleaning solution was for a small bottle. My second order was for a larger bottle. I recommend getting a larger bottle and making your own cleaning cartridges. It would also be a good way to introduce you to refilling your own cartridges.