How good is Precision colors / IS pigment ink?

[Token]

stratman: well, i was using "fuji xerox performer +", which is 80gsm. Not the best of paper, yes, but i have several reams of it, and i dont really feel like spending money to buy different paper, especially when the canon OEM ink performs fine on the xerox paper.

 

[stratman]

Token:

Using the conversions on http://www.papermojo.com/paper_weight_conversion.html (link from ??? here on Nifty-Stuff), I am using 24 lb = 89 gsm Xerox Multifunction paper, relatively inexpensive plain paper.

Reading up on your paper, it sounds like the Fuji Xerox Performer + is not a good choice for color inkjets:


"Performer+ is an economical 80gsm paper from Fuji Xerox suitable for photocopying, monochrome ink jet and laser printing. Performer+ is guaranteed to perform consistently through all Xerox equipment and is available in long grain A4 and short grain A3. Made to Xerox specifications..."


If a paper can be optimized to a certain printer/ink brands formula's, your paper sounds like it is optimized for Xerox brand toner and monochrome inkjet products.

Since you have not noted a problem with Canon OEM ink and your current paper, it makes sense to try a different brand refill ink, like PrecisionColors from Canada or KMP from Europe, to see if quality can be maintained while keeping cost lower. Or else use up your current paper and buy different paper that works well with the ink you can purchase economically.

 

[Token]

Stratman:

I think i will end up changing inks, as i have only a 4oz bottle of pigment black left, and 3/4 bottles of C,M and Y left, and i will finish those before i finish my paper. Hobbicolors ink, while a great inkset for some, is not ideal for me. If i get my ip4500 working fully, i'll probably purchase the PrecisionColors ink. In the mean time, ill just use some thicker paper (or epson high-res paper) if i need to print off a good printout.

 

[dougsewell]

Just received Precision Colours 4oz pigment black and Dye C,Y &M. What a difference. All back to canon original colours again. Bought set of 4 for iP3000 instead of for my iP3500 (a lesson here in being more careful when ordering and not get too excited at the prospect of good inks) However Precision Colours advised me that the only difference in the ink set between these printers is that the Magenta for the iP3000 is tiny bit lighter and quite possibly unnoticable. All in all at about 50p for each refill a great bargain with brilliant results. Advised also to flush carts every 6 refills or so.
Doug

 

[zxcvbnm114]

I noticed when shopping that some of their labels are smudging... (bottom right)
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y20/mikord/C4A_2.jpg (image they use for their ebay auctions)

In reality not very indicitive of anything but amusing.

 

[mikling]

Yes, smudges will occur when handling labels too soon after printing. Nothing to hide here.

Here's reality for me. Labels that I source at a decent price are only available for laser printers. It appears that the surface finsih on these papers meant to survive the heat and prevent curling affects the drying time on labels. Furthermore the application of the label is done by hand and to make sure that the labels stick pressure must be applied with a rubbing or intentional smudging action. With these points, some smudgiung inevitably does indeed occur when output is handled too soon.

I guess the lesson here is that inks react differently with varying papers. If you have the luxury of time, it is always best to let the ink dry before handling with pressure. Labels meant for inkjet papers have a reason for existence over those meant for laser printers. In my case the cost issue can add up quickly so I use those meant for lasers despite the limitations.

If I use a strip of labels, the Canon printer will pause for quite a while to allow drying before ejecting the second sheet. Obviously drying time is a significant issue with fast inkjet printers. This may shed some light as to why the newest printers use hybrid pigments which does bleed more than a pure pigment. That's another reason why when using pure dyebased photoprinters, text never seems as sharp. The dye ink dries much much quicker than pigment ink but it bleeds more.

No ink is perfect, different ones may work better on different papers. Just to let you know, whether you believe it or not those labels are actually Canon OEM ink! I had just moved from using an HP to print labels to a new MP500 and decided to take some new photos. ( For me the HP I had been using handled labels the best but that machine is in the recycling yard now) Respect the drying time issue or you'll end up with the same problems I run into all the time no matter whose ink is used.

 

[pharmacist]

Hi Dougsewell,

I wonder which type of refill ink you did use before the Precisioncolors IM ink ? What was the problem with it ?

 

[dougsewell]

Hi Pharmacist
Used all ink tec inks for a few years now. Had a few clog problems with "Dye" based inks and in fact recently had to return a printer with banding problems. May not have been directly attributed to inks but canon told me that it was a purge problem in the printer. Colours in inktec are quite good but not near to Canons own inks (Slightly more paler) but nothing that a tweek cannot fix. Precision colours on the other hand are spot on for match with canon inks.
Doug

 

[websnail]

Here's reality for me. Labels that I source at a decent price are only available for laser printers. It appears that the surface finsih on these papers meant to survive the heat and prevent curling affects the drying time on labels. Furthermore the application of the label is done by hand and to make sure that the labels stick pressure must be applied with a rubbing or intentional smudging action. With these points, some smudgiung inevitably does indeed occur when output is handled too soon.

You might want to think about resurrecting an old Epson C88 or similar as I will be... The pigment inks on those seem to work a bit better and you're less likely to end up with the smudging... Also, another geek anti-smudge tip... Get one of your used up label back sheets and use that to rub the labels into position. Works much better


After all that though I have to ask myself if it really is sad that I know all this and demonstrate this so publicly... Is there no hope?!!

Oh the humanity!

 

[nche11]

I noticed when shopping that some of their labels are smudging... (bottom right)

Smudging is one thing the crooked edges of text is another. The text on the label appears to be a bit crooked.

By the way, when your ink looks pale you can adjust your printer setup to increase the saturation. But this increase of saturation also increases the noise level of the image. There is a limit that you can increase before the quality of the image worsens. If your ink looks too rich you can do the opposite to decrease the color saturation. Decreasing color saturation does not increase noise level. You can decrease as much as you like. You can decrease the color saturation all the way to turn the image into a black and white image.

I like the color saturation of Hobbicolors UW8 ink. It is on par with OEM in my opinion. I did find that different paper render different image density and saturation. Some paper will give you more density and make you feel it is more saturated. Some other paper will be a little pale and make you feel it has lower saturation. It can be very wrong in judging an ink's color saturation by one printer printing on one type of paper. If one needs to make -18 magenta and -15 yellow adjustment to get the colors right I will say something is very wrong with the printer. Any adjustment greater than +/- 5 is so significant that -18 and -15 has to be very wrong in my opinion.