Hobbicolors Pigment Black w/ Mx860... Will it bleed?

[leo8088]

Ghwellsjr, on the post #4 Pharmacist reported print head clog, not purge unit clog. In the post $5 you reported the purge unit clog. This was the first report of purge unit clog by Inktec pigment black ink and it was by you. In the post #6 pharmacist said: not only purge clog but--- He continued to talk about how the thought the ink clogged the print head. I can agree that he concurred about the purge unit clog. But technically he was not the first to report it. Had you not reported it first he might never mentioned about the purge unit clog at all. In fact in the post #4 Pharmacist said he wasn't the one who experienced the clog. He read of such report on a German site.

I am not debating about whether the Inktec pigment black ink will clog the purge unit or not. I am only trying to point out that you seemed to be the only one reporting about the problem. I am pretty sure I have used the ink and I did not experience the purge unit clog. I do understand what Pharmacist was talking about. I can tell you even the OEM BCI-3ebk ink was like that. Maybe it wasn't as bad as Inktec's. Have you noticed that some dried up BCI-3ebk cartridges need to be flushed or they will not refill well? This does not exist in any PGI-5. I think Inktec's old pigment black ink had a formulation similar to Canon BCI-3ebk. Perhaps it was not as good or perhaps you got a batch of bad ink from Inktec.

In the post #4 Pharmacist only reported print head clog. He did not say anything about purge unit clog. You were the first to report it on post #5. When you reported this I was surprised. That's why I remember you were the first to report it. You repeated the report many times. They really look like beating a dead horse after it's been dead. Sorry to describe it this way. But this was really how I felt. It was a questionable accusation to me in the first place. Then you said Inktec no longer has the ink. What's your purpose to keep repeating the complaint over and over if it is already discontinued?

Let's get the fact straight. It's good that you reported the problem. It helps others from getting the same ink and become victimized. However, it the ink is discontinued then let's check out their replacement ink. If it is a good ink we should use it. If not we can continue to condemn it. This is only fair and good for our pockets.

 

[ghwellsjr]

OK, I see the problem. Here is what I said in the above referenced post #5:

"I have been using Inktec pigment black ink for several years and never had a nozzle clog but I have had a problem with two printers getting their purge units totally clogged and so far, I have been unable to unclog them. Is this the problem that was reported on druckerchannel.de?"

You concluded that since I reported NEVER having a nozzle clog problem with Inktec ink that when I reported having clogged purge units, I was blaming the problem on the Inktec ink, which I was not. I was incredulous that Inktec had any kind of a clogging problem and it was a total surprise to me that the Germans were reporting clogging issues with Inktec ink. I was just asking for more details on what the Germans were reporting. Note the date of this exchange was 8/31/2009.

Two weeks prior to and continuing for over a month past this exchange, there was another exchange where I was reporting my problems with the two printers that had clogged purge units. You will note that I never once mentioned the word "Inktec" in this whole thread. My posts ended on 10/3/2009.

In fact, during this same interval of time, I was still recommending Inktec ink without any concern about their pigment ink. See this post on 9/10/2009 and this post on 9/29/2009.

The first time I expressed a concern for the Inktec pigment black ink was on 10/24/2009 after the third MP780 developed the same problem.

This significantly raised my concern and in late October, I was able to visit my other friends for whom I was supplying ink for their MP780s and discovered that every one of them had the same clog in the pigment ink purge pad. That was what convinced me that it might be related to the Inktec ink and so I posted a new thread asking for anyone with an MP780 to check their purge pads and report what ink they were using. I don't like leveling charges without confirmation but I got no takers, although you did enter into the discussion. I suspect that this is what you were remembering as when I first reported the problem (10/31/2009) with the original Inktec pigment black ink and not on 8/31/2009.

Can we agree on that?

 

[leo8088]

Why are we continue arguing about this? It is never a problem to me that you want to report this Inktec pigment black ink problem repeatedly. The only problem I have is if you already know that the ink is discontinued you need to be careful in bashing it again and again. It is going to mislead a lot of people to avoid Inktec inks all together. In fact Inktec inks are good inks. Despite that you and your friend had many problems with its older black pigment ink but there were not anyone else who had the same problem, except there might be some reports on a German site. That was never verified and might be just individual case that is hard to be for making a conclusion.

I like a good competition out there from Inktec to keep the prices of so called USA made products in check. I still have the bitter memory of near rip off prices from MIS Associates. Let's not so stupid to curse a good vendor to death. That's counter productive for no purposes. Let me repeat it. I had/have good results from Inktec inks. I would like them to improve their customer service though.

 

[ghwellsjr]

If we are arguing about this, it's because you keep bringing it up (like you did on this thread) and making false accusations against me without ever acknowledging that you are doing so even after I repeatedly point out where and why you are wrong.

Do you understand that my concern is in testing currently available popular pigment black inks to find out if any of them have a similar problem? How can you state "In fact Inktec inks are good inks"? I think from the context we are talking about their pigment black ink for PGI-5. If Inktec had admitted that their BCI-3eBK ink had a clogging problem and that is the reason they took it off the market and that they had fixed the problem in their PGI-5 ink, then I would have some confidence that it might not have the same problem. I hope it doesn't have the same problem and I hope there are no other pigment inks that have the same problem. But I am unwilling to simply declare that "In fact Inktec inks are good inks" without actually having a reason to back it up. I want to have some facts at my disposal when I make a statement like that. And I will in a few more months. I hope you are not going to castigate me for doing this test.

 

[leo8088]

There is no need to continue to argue who actually brought up or reported the purge unit clog by Inktec pigment black ink. This wasn't my point of my post. My point was why keep beating a dead horse. The ink was discontinued and you know that. Besides, other than perhaps there was talks about this issue on a German web there has been nobody who actually had the problem and reported on this forum. I did not question the validity of your report. I just voiced my opinion that the horse is already dead. Stop the beating. It may mislead people that current Inktec's pigment black ink is bad. It is not. It is a great ink.

I understand your concern. But honestly, your test method may prove nothing. How do you know it's a valid test?

You do not owe Inktect anything. You are not obligated to say their ink is good. Think about it. If your test is an invalid test you are only going to bash and hurt the company after you finish the test. What if your test is wrong and it implies nothing? Of course you have every right to do whatever test you want and say whatever after testing. In America that is done everyday by a lot of people. Since you bring it up I am telling you my opinion about your test.

 

[ghwellsjr]

This argument is on this thread because you decided to bring me into it. Fish twice mentioned that he had no problem with Inktec ink and then you stated in post #13: "Ghwellsjr had a problem with an Inktec's old pigment black ink too." Why did you do that?

My test method has already proven that there is a tremendous difference between the original Inktec pigment black ink and Image Specialists pigment black ink. I am now repeating the test with a total of ten pigment black inks.

 

[leo8088]

This is a scan of a portion of a sheet of text printed with a Canon OEM PGI-5BK by an ip4300

This second scan is printed by the same printer with Hobbicolors PMT pigment black ink.

I don't know if you can see a difference. I know that if I put them aside for a few days I will probably not be able to distinguish which one is printed by which ink. The paper used here are the copy machine/laser printer paper. I beliebe I got it from Staples a long time ago.

The scan is not only just a portion of the original it is also enlarged. The actual size of the text is much smaller.

 

[leo8088]

Let me try it again. This should gives more detail:

This is the scan of text with HC ink:

 

[ghwellsjr]

Helpful hint: save the scan as a bitmap file, load the file into Paint and resave it as a .png. That way you won't pick up artifacts caused by the lossy compression of jpegs.

What is it that you are trying to show with these images? Are you trying to show that there is no difference between OEM ink and Hobbicolors or that there is a small difference? If you have noticed differences, why don't you point them out because I cannot tell if the differences are caused by the compression of jpeg or actual differences in the printouts.

 

[leo8088]

Just read my post again, OK?