martin0reg
Printer Master
That's the point, I think. The standard plugs are a bit like epandable bolts and should reach a bit into the cart.
Help! Ink Cartridges "depressurizing" (breathing?)
- Thread starter Photographic Memory
- Start date
I'm going to sound like a stuck vinyl record.
The Precision Colors standard plug does NOT use the side of the hole tunnel to seal. It uses the end of the tunnel and it cinches the plug like a tension belt.
The other plug is improperly engineered for the ball hole and the purveyors of these don't seem to understand vector forces and physics.
Let me elaborate. The ball tunnel in the OEM Canon carts have a conical taper. This is so that the inserted plastic ball slowly gets tensioned as it is pushed in and is held in a groove towards the end of the tunnel. This taper will always pinch the plug BUT the only thing to keep the plug in is friction. When you wet the side of the tunnel wall, what happens? Friction is greatly reduced. Over time this fit of the plug will always have an upward force component that ALWAYS want to push the plug up and if you are unlucky it becomes loose and drops into the printer.
Then where does it go?
That is the reason why these plugs are improper for the Canon ball tunnel. If you are going to use these, then you MUST have straight sided walls.
The standard Precision Colors plugs, if you look carefully when they are installed, will need some reaming for the plug to fit correctly, but once it is done, it is NEVER going to pop out.
There are details and there are appearances. I delve into the details.
The Precision Colors standard plug does NOT use the side of the hole tunnel to seal. It uses the end of the tunnel and it cinches the plug like a tension belt.
The other plug is improperly engineered for the ball hole and the purveyors of these don't seem to understand vector forces and physics.
Let me elaborate. The ball tunnel in the OEM Canon carts have a conical taper. This is so that the inserted plastic ball slowly gets tensioned as it is pushed in and is held in a groove towards the end of the tunnel. This taper will always pinch the plug BUT the only thing to keep the plug in is friction. When you wet the side of the tunnel wall, what happens? Friction is greatly reduced. Over time this fit of the plug will always have an upward force component that ALWAYS want to push the plug up and if you are unlucky it becomes loose and drops into the printer.
Then where does it go?
That is the reason why these plugs are improper for the Canon ball tunnel. If you are going to use these, then you MUST have straight sided walls.
The standard Precision Colors plugs, if you look carefully when they are installed, will need some reaming for the plug to fit correctly, but once it is done, it is NEVER going to pop out.
There are details and there are appearances. I delve into the details.
Yes, the tip of the plug go BEYOND the end of the tunnel and once past there, the smaller opening of the tunnel, cinches the plug like a barrel hoop.
- Thread starter
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Photographic Memory
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I think I am going to need some of those plugs!
Something happened inside that tupperware box with Isopryl Alcohol. The PVC's tackiness was all gooey and when I pushed down the Plug into one of the Carts within a few seconds you could see the Plug slowly rise out again on its own! Without added reinforcement (Tape) those Plugs are unpredictable.
Notice I haven't promoted 'The German Method', this is my first time filling and have adapted to The Top Fill Method, but this is definitely +1 for Das Deutsch!
The Carts I took out the Printer to replace and refill, their Plug was fine. Dry and not so slippery to get out the hole, but definitely not stuck in there where you have to pry it out with a fingernail.
Something happened inside that tupperware box with Isopryl Alcohol. The PVC's tackiness was all gooey and when I pushed down the Plug into one of the Carts within a few seconds you could see the Plug slowly rise out again on its own! Without added reinforcement (Tape) those Plugs are unpredictable.
Notice I haven't promoted 'The German Method', this is my first time filling and have adapted to The Top Fill Method, but this is definitely +1 for Das Deutsch!
The Carts I took out the Printer to replace and refill, their Plug was fine. Dry and not so slippery to get out the hole, but definitely not stuck in there where you have to pry it out with a fingernail.
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I would say the plugs you are using are too short to seal and "stay" in in the ball plug hole. PC plugs are much more reliable (IMO),. The hole (I drill mine, I don't pull the ball), must be a snug fit to the plug. I have to force them in and pry them out. I use a cuticle cutter under the lip as a prying tool. I also use a dull pointed tool to insert in the plug's hole once lifted most of the way out to secure them and make it easier to handle them for re-insertion. I put them in part way with the tool, remove the tool (by spinning it), and use a flat tool to force the plug in the rest of the way until the plug's lip is flush with the cart.
Also, when you said you were instructed to "fill to the top", just how far did you fill the reservoir side? I always leave at least 1/8" air space at the top. I block the air maze with tape, and block the outlet port, prior to filling, then after the cart is sufficiently filled, I remove the outlet port and squeeze the cart sponge compartment sides to release several drops of ink out the outlet port (into a waste container). Then I reseal the outlet port, and place the cart into storage, or right to use.
The "German method" has it's own set of issues to deal with, BTW...
In short, the plugs MUST seal 100%, and they should be somewhat difficult to remove after being fully inserted.
I suspect alcohol fumes are attacking/softening the tape adhesive. I don't bother with any such special "storage" fluids.
All that said, I have never been able to prevent filling the upper sponge. I don't know how Canon does it but I suspect once it's been partially wetted with ink, there's no stopping further absorption (IMO). HOWEVER, liquid ABOVE the sponge is not acceptable. If I see this condition,I wick out some ink from the outlet port using a wadded up paper towel to get rid of this "overfilling situation".
Also, when you said you were instructed to "fill to the top", just how far did you fill the reservoir side? I always leave at least 1/8" air space at the top. I block the air maze with tape, and block the outlet port, prior to filling, then after the cart is sufficiently filled, I remove the outlet port and squeeze the cart sponge compartment sides to release several drops of ink out the outlet port (into a waste container). Then I reseal the outlet port, and place the cart into storage, or right to use.
The "German method" has it's own set of issues to deal with, BTW...
In short, the plugs MUST seal 100%, and they should be somewhat difficult to remove after being fully inserted.
I suspect alcohol fumes are attacking/softening the tape adhesive. I don't bother with any such special "storage" fluids.
All that said, I have never been able to prevent filling the upper sponge. I don't know how Canon does it but I suspect once it's been partially wetted with ink, there's no stopping further absorption (IMO). HOWEVER, liquid ABOVE the sponge is not acceptable. If I see this condition,I wick out some ink from the outlet port using a wadded up paper towel to get rid of this "overfilling situation".
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The german Durchstich refill method is not optimal, but it does auto equalize the pressure inside the sponge and you will have not have problems with plugs not properly sealed or not.
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I don't use the German method. My reasons:
-Canon themselves originally fill via the top fill method, then. plugs the fill hole with a ball.
-The German method requires drilling a fine hole in a location that never had a hole there, and if you seal the outlet port AND the vent, it WILL leak ink out this new hole. I've had that happen. You must leave the vent open to prevent ink leakage. I store my top-filled refilled carts with the vent sealed with tape, just like Canon does.
-Navigating/piercing the fill needle through the new hole and lower sponge to enter the ink reservoir can be really tricky/takes some practice, and can, at times, displace the sponge sufficiently so it will lose contact with the outlet port wick.
That said, some users here swear by (and sometimes AT) the German method!
-Canon themselves originally fill via the top fill method, then. plugs the fill hole with a ball.
-The German method requires drilling a fine hole in a location that never had a hole there, and if you seal the outlet port AND the vent, it WILL leak ink out this new hole. I've had that happen. You must leave the vent open to prevent ink leakage. I store my top-filled refilled carts with the vent sealed with tape, just like Canon does.
-Navigating/piercing the fill needle through the new hole and lower sponge to enter the ink reservoir can be really tricky/takes some practice, and can, at times, displace the sponge sufficiently so it will lose contact with the outlet port wick.
That said, some users here swear by (and sometimes AT) the German method!
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You ream the plug??? Or do you ream the ball hole to slightly enlarge it?
I do not recall either of these functions in your instructions for using your plugs when I purchased them for my CLI-8 cartridges years ago.
Did your plugs change over the years?
Regardless, I've used one CLI-8 cartridge with a 5/32" drilled hole near the unremoved ball hole that has stayed securely in from PC for years with a standard silicone plug. (there was no low profile plug at that time) I refill it using the Durchstich Method. I also have one CLI-8 cartridge with a top fill hole sealed by hot glue gun that has stayed securely closed for years as well. This cartridge is also filled with the Durchstich method. Rag tag but its worked and I will not change it while it continues to work.
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It should be noted that one of the most prolific refillers on the forum uses the Durchstich method. One of the least prolific refillers on the forum does as well (me). We both use the Canon MP830 with PC ink and OEM cartridges.
Refill method passion have been akin to fanboy Intel vs AMD dust ups. My view is if it works for you - great, if it doesn't work for you then maybe it's because of you. The beauty of refilling, at least in the old days, was individuality. Whatever you enjoy, makes sense to you, and accommodates any physical limitations you may have is the method to use.
***
Forum consensus these days is to refill via the Top method, including the OP's Pro-100s, and to refill when the printer warns of the spongeless side is at or near empty. It is best to not let the sponge lose ink and begin drying of the sponge-ink interface as this may ultimately result in poor ink flow (ink starvation) and require a flush of the cartridge.
Refill method passion have been akin to fanboy Intel vs AMD dust ups. My view is if it works for you - great, if it doesn't work for you then maybe it's because of you. The beauty of refilling, at least in the old days, was individuality. Whatever you enjoy, makes sense to you, and accommodates any physical limitations you may have is the method to use.
***
Forum consensus these days is to refill via the Top method, including the OP's Pro-100s, and to refill when the printer warns of the spongeless side is at or near empty. It is best to not let the sponge lose ink and begin drying of the sponge-ink interface as this may ultimately result in poor ink flow (ink starvation) and require a flush of the cartridge.
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Photographic Memory
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PeterBJ: "Also, when you said you were instructed to "fill to the top", just how far did you fill the reservoir side? I always leave at least 1/8" air space at the top. I block the air maze with tape, and block the outlet port, prior to filling, then after the cart is sufficiently filled, "
Well even when I read "fill to the top" I still left about 3/8 and since yesterday I thought that this was overfilling so now I left about half an inch. I guess 3/8 is fine then? Yes block the Air Maze during fill, when the Cart is half full?
I really believe now this is down to the Isopryl Alcohol as the fumes were potent when I open the box. Even after 3 days, good job I didn't have the carts in storage for a long period. And yes these Plugs are not ideal at all, but they work as long they are reinforced with Tape.
Where can I buy some new Plugs (UK)? (Even just for spares, will see what OctoInk has on offer, maybe even Precision in Canada). I really don't want to "ream" anything if at all possible. I will see what is available?
Edit: I wrote "the Sponges are not ideal, changed to Plugs"
Well even when I read "fill to the top" I still left about 3/8 and since yesterday I thought that this was overfilling so now I left about half an inch. I guess 3/8 is fine then? Yes block the Air Maze during fill, when the Cart is half full?
I really believe now this is down to the Isopryl Alcohol as the fumes were potent when I open the box. Even after 3 days, good job I didn't have the carts in storage for a long period. And yes these Plugs are not ideal at all, but they work as long they are reinforced with Tape.
Where can I buy some new Plugs (UK)? (Even just for spares, will see what OctoInk has on offer, maybe even Precision in Canada). I really don't want to "ream" anything if at all possible. I will see what is available?
Edit: I wrote "the Sponges are not ideal, changed to Plugs"
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