Glossy/Pearlized/Metallic paper and dye/pigment inks

[Fenrir Enterprises]

So I may or may not be getting an R2000 in the near future. I already have a 2x 1400s, one pigment, one dye, and a WF 1100 that I'm not using and probably doesn't work anymore now that I've I bought a B&W inkset for it. I *really* don't need another printer (or have room for it) but if the price drops any lower I'm probably not going to be able to resist getting it.

Anyway, I'm wondering just how big a difference dyebase vs pigment + GLOP there is on specialized papers, like metallic and pearlescent. The GLOP may be able to restore the gloss/reduce bronzing but won't the areas with heavier pigment also reduce/eliminate the special effect the paper was intended for?

The reason I have different inksets in the 1400s are to print matte/luster/vinyl stickers with the pigment and high gloss/specialty paper with the dye, but maybe I won't need the dyebased one if I have an R2000? Or will the dyebased ink still work better on metallic papers? Still probably going to keep the pigment 1400 for vinyl stickers/banner/laminated temporary signs/etc since it'll be cheaper to run/refill than the R2000 will be.

 

[Ink stained Fingers]

The GLOP may be able to restore the gloss/reduce bronzing but won't the areas with heavier pigment also reduce/eliminate the special effect the paper was intended for?

Yes, pigments are not translucent, and special surface effects will only remain visible in areas with less ink coverage. Beyond that it is not possible to make general statements about pigment inks and their behaviour on particular papers, inks from different suppliers may look quite different on a particular paper/surface in regards to bronzing and gloss/differentials. Dye inks are much more foregiving in that respect.

 

[Roy Sletcher]

Anyway, I'm wondering just how big a difference dyebase vs pigment + GLOP there is on specialized papers, like metallic and pearlescent. The GLOP may be able to restore the gloss/reduce bronzing but won't the areas with heavier pigment also reduce/eliminate the special effect the paper was intended for?

Seeing you have access to all the technologies you mention above, my thought is that your best course is to experiment for yourself and see what gives the best results FOR YOU. I don't think there is any rigid dogma about best practices for using various colorants on different substrates, especially third party combinations. Second, there are so many other variables such as permanence, light fastness, scratch resistance etc that are rated at varying degrees of importance depending on end use.

From my perspective the Red River 66lb Polar Pearl Metallic gives a far better result when printed on my Canon Pro100 compared to my Epson 3880. When using a good glossy paper such as Red River Ultrapro Gloss I still prefer the Canon Dye inks over the Epson K3 pigments, but the result as much closer and could be subject to individual interpretation and characteristics of individual pictures. On soft fibre semigloss Baryta papers the Epson K3 pigment inks are truly outstanding, and in my opinion better that the canon pro100 on the same paper.

The above paragraph is all my own opinion, and could well be contrary to others findings. Hence my original hypothesis - you have to try the variables for yourself.

rs

 

[Fenrir Enterprises]

Thanks guys. I never really feel comfortable even giving away dyebased prints (I like my aftermarket supplier but I don't even trust OEM dye, really...) nevermind selling them, but dyebased just works better for some things... I haven't tried this combination yet but I wonder if I used a really high quality gloss paper like Canon's Platinum whether even an R2000 with GLOP would maintain the mirror shine that the paper has.

Also trying to come up with a reason to get rid of a printer but I get the feeling I'm going to have FOUR now. >_< I was thinking of changing one of the 1400s to B&W and ditching the 1100 entirely, but I may want to keep them the way they are...

 

[The Hat]

Also trying to come up with a reason to get rid of a printer but I get the feeling I'm going to have FOUR now

You can never have enough of theses little beauties, printer addiction can not be cured…

 

[Ink stained Fingers]

I'm not sure what your plans/expectations are from the R2000 - running that with 3rd party inks , and getting/expecting to get a gloss/shine as good as with dye inks ? Or hoping that the gamut with the additional colors gets beyond the gamut of the 1400's ? You may try something else before you invest that money - you get the WF1100 working and fill gloss opt. into the cartridges, do your prints with pigment inks on the 1400, and run a second print pass with GLOP on the 1100, you can easily adjust the GLOP amount by printing a plain gray - dark to light - full page patch. This would show you directly what you can expect from the GLOP on various papers before you actually buy and use the R2000 for this purpose. This gives you all options to test, with your existing hardware, and you even will find out that 3rd party gloss opt. inks from different suppliers may look different, and you even could create a semiglossy to semimatte finish this way which has been discussed already elsewhere here in the forum. And with another cartridge set you still could use the 1100 for B/W prints with suitable inks.

 

[Roy Sletcher]

You can never have enough of theses little beauties, printer addiction can not be cured…

Yes but now you can get the PRINTER ADDICTION vaccine - It is labelled OEM INK. Very expensive and not covered by any health plan I know of. Truly a case of the cure being worse than the disease.

rs

 

[The Hat]

It is labelled OEM INK.

I regard contact with OEM ink as fatal, so I steer clear of the dreaded stuff..

 

[Fenrir Enterprises]

I was just trying to decide whether or not it was worth keeping a dyebased printer around for effects papers, from what I've read so far it looks like yes. It might be the pigment 1400 that gets switched to B&W since the R2000 will hold rolls of printable vinyl and maybe I'm better off just using that one for everything I need pigment printed, even if there's more colors to refill.

That's if I even get the R2000, will just have to wait and see.