Canon CLI refilling experiences?

[jackson]

I was looking at the refill method where the long needle is passed from the sponge to the reservoir and I could not make out if the needle was passing through the sponge which rests on top of the exit port.
It looks like the that needle has to 'feel' it's way through the sponge and hope that it hits the hole into the reservoir.

 

[Defcon2k]

I was looking at the refill method where the long needle is passed from the sponge to the reservoir and I could not make out if the needle was passing through the sponge which rests on top of the exit port.

I examined the carts, and I would say: no, it doesn't. This is because the small sponge(filter) in the OEM carts sits only in the exit port, but does not enter the sponge chamber, like this one does:

It looks like the that needle has to 'feel' it's way through the sponge and hope that it hits the hole into the reservoir.

It's actually quite easy, because the path of the needle is near the bottom of the cart, so you can see its way through the sponge:

When your needle is not blunt, but like this, you can control the path of the needle by turning it. You can see that the needle gets too far to the left? Just turn it 180 and it will travel to the right.
After the first refill it's even easier, because the needle takes the same path through the sponge as the last time.

 

[Tin Ho]

I really do not think this is a good refilling method. The needle will cause some damage to the structure of the sponge in an area where it is critical in terms of regulating ink flow. Repeated punctuate through the sponge near the ink exit port will eventually damage it enough to change the ink feeding behavior. Why not just punch a small hole on the top of the reserve tank to refill? A small sized glue gun can easily plug it up after refill. It can be unplugged for refill again without drilling next time. If you want your oem CLI8 carts long lived this is the method to go.

 

[Defcon2k]

Well, on the german refill sites I know it becomes more and more the recommended method for refilling Canon carts.
I also tried refilling with hot glue and a hole in the reserve tank, but I find this method faster and easier. I can't say much about the lifespan of the carts, because I refilled mine only 6-7 times with this method, but there are some other people who refilled their carts 20-30x without problems so far, and one person who counted 30-50 refills per cart, and he says that they are still going strong. (Without flushing the carts, because this technique is little known here.)

But everybody is entitled to their own opinion. That's the beauty of having multiple refilling methods to choose from: just use the method you like best.

 

[canonfodder]

I am prone to agree with Tin Ho on the sponge damage issue.

I don't know what damage goes on in the sponge when you penetrate it, but it would seem that if your needle could get under the sponge, lifting it a wee bit, and only temporarily, it would be best. I would expect that a needle tip that is drawn down to a small but smoothly rounded tip would be best.

In fabric work, some needles are rounded instead of sharp. They are used to force their way between threads, rather than split threads. It is better for the fabric. One could desire a hypo needle with that type of tip, to push the sponge aside (or up) rather than piercing it.

After filling, the sponge has to be back in place and in full contact with the output filter for the cart to function properly in printing. If you don't push the sponge around too much, that may take care of itself.

 

[jackson]

On a non-oem cart, the filter extends 5mm into the main sponge.
A needle coming in from the right will have a problem.
It's not possible to 'feel' a needle across the floor.It has to be by guess or by god and hope you hit the reservoir.(or go through the filter)

 

[Defcon2k]

The sponge damage question was also discussed here before, and is brought up again occasionally by first-time refillers. The general opinion seems to be that it is more or less a theoretical consideration. In practice, there seems to be no noticable deterioration of the sponge. *
Also bear in mind that after the first refill, you use more or less the same path for the needle for every refill.

But as I said before: just use the method which works best for you and which you are most comfortable with.
I personally like this one very much so far, but fortunately there are plenty of other refilling methods if you have the same reservations as Tin Ho and cannonfodder.



*edit:
Personally, I think this: The sponge will not hold forever, but I think it will be okay for a surprising amount of refills (at least with OEM carts, jackson's non-OEMs seem not to be well suited for this refilling method). Perhaps the cart will be long dead due to other reasons before it reaches that point.

If I had a spare cart and time, I would do an endurance test: One could penetrate the sponge over and over again (20 times, 40 times, ..., 100 times) and see if and when it becomes a problem. It would take a good amount of time though (~15 sec/try), because one would try to push the needle through the same path, as you do with the normal refilling process.

 

[Defcon2k]

Ok, you got me wondering, so I tested it for myself.

I pierced the yellow cart 300x by pushing the needle all the way into the ink reserve chamber and pulling it out again.


This was no problem for the cart: There was not a single drop of ink coming out of the exit hole or the refill hole.


I waited some minutes, and then installed the cart again (without sealing the refill hole, as usual).
Then I printed a nozzle check (perfect), and then printed a whole page of yellow to see if there is an ink supply problem. No, it was also perfect.
If the yellow cart shows any signs of degradation during the next couple of days, I will keep you informed... but I doubt that.

The sponge may be okay even much longer, but I think 300x is enough for me. The cart may long have died before due to other reasons, and even if not: considering my current ink consumption rate, it would take me 20 years to reach 300 refills.

 

[jackson]

I ground a point on one of my blunt needles and filled a non-oem, black, 3e tank.
It's certainly cleaner inasmuch as there's no 'blow back' from little inky bubbles coming out of the refill hole and no wiping up.
If it works out I will consider trying it with a full set.
It would certainly impress the unenlightened to see the upside down tank being filled with ink.

 

[jackson]

I was looking at the refill method where the long needle is passed from the sponge to the reservoir and I could not make out if the needle was passing through the sponge which rests on top of the exit port.

I examined the carts, and I would say: no, it doesn't. This is because the small sponge(filter) in the OEM carts sits only in the exit port, but does not enter the sponge chamber, like this one does:

http://www.nifty-stuff.com/docs/media/SpongeDown.jpg

It looks like the that needle has to 'feel' it's way through the sponge and hope that it hits the hole into the reservoir.

It's actually quite easy, because the path of the needle is near the bottom of the cart, so you can see its way through the sponge:

http://www.enderlin-direkt.com/extimage/images/canon/single-dirt1.jpg

http://www.enderlin-direkt.com/extimage/images/canon/single-dirt2.jpg

When your needle is not blunt, but like this, you can control the path of the needle by turning it. You can see that the needle gets too far to the left? Just turn it 180 and it will travel to the right.
After the first refill it's even easier, because the needle takes the same path through the sponge as the last time.

This shows the difference between an oem and a third party cart when using the injection method of refilling.
The angle described by the needle in this third party cart depends on the depth of the filter (how deep into the sponge) and the plastic extension which positions the tank in the head.The dark line was added to show the angle better.You can see the needle tip nudging the prism.