BASICS of understanding Canon Carts and Long Term Storage

[mikling]

A person ( Not Hat) need to understand what makes a Canon Sponge Cart dangerous to long term storage or is it? Also needs to reexamine the knowledge he puts out as wise advice which many know here is wrong.

I will leave you with some questions. If you don't understand then think about it.

1. Why is there a serpentine in the Canon Carts?

2. How is this serpentine vent and itermediate chambers supposed to work?

3. When it is working, what variables in the cart determines how well it works?

4. How is this related to storing carts on the printhead?

If you cannot answer those 4 questions then you will not understand the aspects of storing printers with carts.

5. Why does Canon ship printheads with fluid inside?

A sorely misunderstood reason and from what I have read massively misunderstood and bad practices are sometimes touted.

This will need some engineering knowledge so it could be restricted to some readers like an age warning to some viewers.

 

[apetitphoto]

You people need to understand what makes a Canon Sponge Cart dangerous to long term storage or is it?

I will leave you with some questions. If you don't understand then think about it.

1. Why is there a serpentine in the Canon Carts?

2. How is this serpentine vent and itermediate chambers supposed to work?

3. When it is working, what variables in the cart determines how well it works?

4. How is this related to storing carts on the printhead?

If you cannot answer those 4 questions then you will not understand the aspects of storing printers with carts.

5. Why does Canon ship printheads with fluid inside?

A sorely misunderstood reason and from what I have read massively misunderstood and bad practices are sometimes touted.

This will need some engineering knowledge so it could be restricted to some readers like an age warning to some viewers.

Thought proving questions.

 

[PalaDolphin]

I liken doing your own printing and refilling cartridges to the desire to gain as much control of the output of your photography as owning your own darkroom was in the film days. One major difference is that you can check out a book from the library on how to build and run a darkroom. But, there are few sources on how to refill cartridges and maintain a healthy printer.

There's no easily accessible resource to answer any of those questions.

I totally respect those who put forth the effort to teach us noobies the art of printer maintenance and cartridge refilling. You think you've gotten away from all the chemistry involved in film photography by going digital but the fact of the matter is it is always going to boil down to complicated chemistry. We're talking about painting the art that you created through your lens digitally onto a canvas. Something has to perform that painting and it's down to the art and science of ink jet printing. My Pro-100 does it in 4800 x 2400 dpi and I have no glasses sharp enough to see dots that small. How it moves the paper to the exact place to put those dots of each color is a mystery. I understand it fires ink off like bullets from a gun. How it keeps those ink jets wet and ready is of concern but I really have no idea how to help it stay wet. I know more about silver bromide, fixer, Tri-X Pan film, Ilford paper and how a latent image appears on photo paper than how my printer performs its magic.

What I would like to know is what I need to know to keep it performing well.

 

[The Hat]

O Yah...What makes you such an expert over every other “You People” because I personally find your remarks very condescending and completely out of hand.

You should try and answer your own questions before asking others to do so, because they’re all loaded and have countless answers correct and otherwise.

Just because “You People” don’t follow your recommendations does not make them all wrong, they do things differently than you to achieve the same outcome, God is of many faiths not just one, no two situations are the same and you of all people should know this.

5. Why does Canon ship printheads with fluid inside?

Because they want to insure it arrives into the purchasers’ environment in the best possible condition, but hey, they still won’t guarantee it, packed in fluid or not, unless its accompanied by a new printer.

The Maxify printer is shipped with the print head in situ that doesn’t come in a fluid wrapped bag, and it doesn’t suffer from any long-term effects, so what’s so wrong with “You People” doing much the same.

You’ve heard several “You People” having their own success with the way they store away their printers, could you not just accept that, because offering good advice is still acceptable here, but patronising “You People” just sounds so bad. Your better than that Mikling...

 

[mikling]

The Maxify being refilled by Palombian ran into some issues with drips and this is one reason why it is not as critical on the Maxify.

5 years ago someone on this board went into hiding. He has reappeared touting the same misinformation over and over again. That person was shown to be completely wrong and then hid. Now he has reappeared. His points are pretty much on direction at me. I will stay away.

 

[Flying Scotsman]

A lot of what is getting spoken about her is over my head but as I have said before I thought that the idea of forums like this was for people to share their knowledge and help others out.
I have found that ALMOST everyone on here has been of the same mindset but there's always one .....

 

[palombian]

It can be frustrating there are not always clear answers.
Since there are no textbooks, what is told on this forum is mostly from own experience, with trial and error, and sharing with others.
That's why maybe the more people know about, the more they weigh their words.

But IMO it is one of the best sources of information to manage your printers, refilling or not.
You have to make your own choices.

On topic:

I have limited understanding of the serpentine vent, I only know there is a lot of ingeniosity in it.
But I'll stick my neck out and try:

1. to let air into the cart on a controlled way without ink leaks

2. the air comes in on top of the sponge (no ink leaks there) and is guided to the ink chamber (where the ink only can come down when air can come in)

3. spong construction, condition (not dry) and placement

4. sponge will dry out over time, aspiring the ink from the chamber

5. see @The Hat 's answer

 

[palombian]

The Maxify being refilled by Palombian ran into some issues with drips and this is one reason why it is not as critical on the Maxify.

5 years ago someone on this board went into hiding. He has reappeared touting the same misinformation over and over again. That person was shown to be completely wrong and then hid. Now he has reappeared. His points are pretty much on direction at me. I will stay away.

As far as I can conclude from a week and about 100p on refilled OEM's: no drips or ink contamination.

 

[Roy Sletcher]

I liken doing your own printing and refilling cartridges to the desire to gain as much control of the output of your photography as owning your own darkroom was in the film days. One major difference is that you can check out a book from the library on how to build and run a darkroom. But, there are few sources on how to refill cartridges and maintain a healthy printer.

There's no easily accessible resource to answer any of those questions.

I totally respect those who put forth the effort to teach us noobies the art of printer maintenance and cartridge refilling. You think you've gotten away from all the chemistry involved in film photography by going digital but the fact of the matter is it is always going to boil down to complicated chemistry. We're talking about painting the art that you created through your lens digitally onto a canvas. Something has to perform that painting and it's down to the art and science of ink jet printing. My Pro-100 does it in 4800 x 2400 dpi and I have no glasses sharp enough to see dots that small. How it moves the paper to the exact place to put those dots of each color is a mystery. I understand it fires ink off like bullets from a gun. How it keeps those ink jets wet and ready is of concern but I really have no idea how to help it stay wet. I know more about silver bromide, fixer, Tri-X Pan film, Ilford paper and how a latent image appears on photo paper than how my printer performs its magic.

What I would like to know is what I need to know to keep it performing well.

A good thought provoking post.

In my opinion refilling and inkjet printing is a far more complex operation than the old world darkroom operations which were mainly monochrome. Colour inkjet printing is infinitely more complex.Especially as you have to contend with the conversion from additive RGB to the subtractive CMYK colour models.

If you truly want to follow the KISS principle then OEM is the way to go, and you will pay dearly for the privilege.

Thus the true underlying reason many embark on refilling is not really a wish for quality and overall control, but the human desire to save a buck. Many fall for the eBay shysters $19,99 one size fits all packages. It is usually downhill from there with predicable results.

To answer the PalaDolphin's question. I do not think there is any ONE readily available source for information. This site is one of the best for discussing evolving technology and practical refilling, but somewhat stilted in content and would benefit from more free flowing opinions.

Other options are "SOME" Youtube channels and our own Jose Rodriguez comes to mind with his EXCELLENT CONTENT. Unfortunately most Youtube content shows there much ignorance out there, and those that have it are most anxious to share it with the world.

To summarize - info is hard to come by. Dig into forums and internet resource. At least they are mostly free.

rs

 

[Tin Ho]

Ink cartridges need a vent so that ink can flow downward for the print head to print.
The vent at the top needs to be as small as possible to keep ink from drying up.
A serpentine (a non engineering term but OK) is one huge step to achieve better prevention of ink drying.
HP ink cartridges all have the serpentine (I hate this term, it is very not HP) on everyone of its ink cartridges.
Ink drying starts with water content vaporizing. The vapor would have escaped into air quickly if there were no serpentine.
The serpentine is a long tiny tunnel. When the vapor enters it it condenses back into liquid (water) again. It blocks the tunnel.
The condensation process slows down vapor from escaping thus keeps the ink from drying up quickly.
Don't store cartridges with the seal opened for too long. The serpentine only slows ink drying.

I learned a lot from this board before, long before some sales people started to show up on board here.
I will not hesitate to offer my 2 cents always. Sales people will probably hate me for speaking out. Can't help it.
If I am wrong forgive me. I will relearn from mistakes.