Anybody try "spongeless carts" ???

[d87cfv]

All the single tank epsons are Spongeless originally so one would like to think they would work fine!

Canon ones as we all know have a sponge in, i may be wrong but i think mainly to regulate the flow of ink. Perhaps the Epson printhead works differently?

Regs,

D

 

[websnail]

All the single tank epsons are Spongeless originally so one would like to think they would work fine!

Canon ones as we all know have a sponge in, i may be wrong but i think mainly to regulate the flow of ink. Perhaps the Epson printhead works differently?

I started responding to the post previous until the cat "helpfully" leapt up to help me with my typing.. *blink* and it was gone.. but to paraphrase...

I suspect the reason the Epsons work well with spongeless is that down the size of the outlet.. I'm no engineer or materials expert here but it seems that the lack of ability for air to seep (due to surface tension maybe?) in from below makes it easier to create a spongeless design.

The big ports on the Canons however causes all sorts of problems in the same respect and I'm sure I saw posts from Grandad and others showing how important the sponge positioning was in stopping free flow of ink after flushing out sponged carts. Like I said, no expert at all but I doubt the lessons learned from the Epsons can be applied to the Canon branch and a sponge is probably vital in ensuring that there's not too much pressure that could cause a free flow.


To be fair I'm a CIS user anyway so a sponge or not is pretty moot because it's not a limiting factor in ink capacity. The only hiccup waiting in the wings is potential algae build up, but that's mainly avoided through careful priming of the system to avoid anything more than a small amount of air in the cartridge.

 

[Bertil]

A couple of days ago I received my spongeless carts for a Canon 560(refilled ones only sold) and they work perfectly.Good colours ,no leakage so far and seemingly very,very easy to refill of course.A small note in the box said that there was a 5 percent risk of the carts leaking when opening them.Mine were okay though.I got so enthusiastic that I ordered a new set just in case ....Unfortunately I threw away the boxes but perhaps they were named Inktec or Inkjet.Price here in Sweden about 11 dollars.They should be for sale -at a lower price-in the United States too.Also available for many other Canon ,Epson and HP-models.If you want to see what the carts look like here is the Internet adress:www.digiview.se All in Swedish of course!Dont try to email!Good luck with your detective work!

 

[canonfodder]

FNO Warning. Read only if you have a technical interest.

This half off thread, and half on thread. It concerns Canon iP4200, etc., the chipped devils, and CIS.

I am seriously considering a CIS that uses the maker's own spongeless cartridge in the printer. The maker has solid claims and some good reports. A spongeless in the CIS assembly is very desirable, as a periodic flushing is probably avoided. The CIS assembly offers a unique opportunity for its designer, in that he can more directly control the ink pressure sent to the print head.

The action of a sponge in a cartridge is a little on the black magic side. The presence of two different textures of sponge in the Canon OEM cartridges makes the mystery even deeper. Canon doesn't do this for laughs. They may have learned from a great deal of emperical trials. When I look at the combination of the sponges, the air vent above them, the necessity of perfect sealing of the tank side, and the ink path at the bottom of the tank into the bottom of the sponge, I believe I understand the goal, but I could not predict that it would be accomplished.

Maybe the sponged cartridge function is somewhat like a felt tip marker. The marker is willing to give up ink when the tip is touching something that will absorb some ink, but it won't continue to flow and puddle once the touched spot is wet enough. (The felt tip marker normally is touched to paper, but will act the same way when touching something that can only absorb so much ink before being too wet to absorb more.) When needed, more ink is fed to the marker tip from the wick-like material in the tube which is the marker's ink reservois. There is a definite air vent in the marker's reservois area. If one were to tap an ink tank into the marker's ink reservois tube, maybe part way up the tube, and have it be a sealed tank with no top air vent, would the ink move from this tank into the the reservois tube's wick material just as needed, and not more? Since the tank will drop to a negative pressure when ink is removed, only wicking action, due to low enough surface tension, will move ink from the tank and into the wick. When the pressure in the tank is low enough, some air must be allowed into the tank. This air must come through the wick of the reservois and back into the ink tank, and as it does, the tank pressure will rise enough to allow a bit more ink to move into the wick.

Now, figure out how to make a felt tip marker with a felt-like tip, which uses ink with a viscosity near water, has a tank of liquid ink connecting directly to the felt tip, and isn't prone to letting too much ink go through the felt tip and mess up your shirt pocket. I would never, ever, say it can't be done, but I believe it would be a big challenge to the ingenuity of the engineer who would tackle the problem.

If making a spongeless cartridge is for simplicity, that could be a business reason to try.
If making a spongeless cartridge is for economy, that may not be a good enough reason. Very small costs.
If making a spongeless cartridge is to eliminate periodic flushing, that would be good.
If making a spongeless cartridge just moves a problem on down to the print head, is that good?

I understand that periodic cartridge flushing is to remove some collected gunk from the sponge.
Without a sponge, does the same gunk collect in the wick material at the print head entrance?
Wouldn't gunk in the print head entrance wick, if it occurs, be a problem?
If there were no sponge, could we imagine that no gunk would form?
Are my hopes for the CIS with no sponges, thus no periodic flushing, just false hopes?
Haven't I typed enough now?

 

[Trigger 37]

Fish Cris,...

On your last post in this thread you indicated that your black ink flooded the print head and contaminated the other colors. I had this happen also but with the Cyan ink. I through the cart away but I remember now it was from G&G. I still have two more G&G BCI-6 carts and I don't think I want to try them. Of course there could be a different problem, like air leakage which allows ink to flow out. The "Sponge" technology" acts like a "buffer" and holds the ink from flowing. The print heads actually "Suck" the ink our of the cart so there has to be a good balance with the sponge and the air vent hole and the viscosity of the ink. Change any of these and I suspect there will be a problem.

I have been refilling my ink carts using a set of refillable sponge carts from "AtlalnticInkjet.com" for more than 2 years. I've gone through 8oz of black ink and about 4 oz of each color. After 2 years I had a problem with Cyan ink and could not get the colors to come out right. I won't bore you with the 500 things I tried to fix the problem,.. but the answer was my Cyan refillable cart finally got so clogged the printer could not suck ink out of it enough to print the correct colors. I installed a new Cyan Cart and fixed the problem. When a sponge cart gets old it can cause problems that look like clogged print head or many other things. The symptom was everything printed with a "Magenta" or red cast. This is because there was not enough "Cyan to balance out the Magenta. It also would not print shades of gray, which in ink jet printers is done with mixing the right balance of CMY and not any black. The test patterns for gray would come out either total black or various darkness of brown or tan or red. All because of insufficient Cyan ink.

My problem is I can't remember who I got the G&G ink from so I can return it. I don't want to waste some more good carts by installing one G&G and having it contaiminate the other two.

 

[Bertil]

I recently installed a set of three in my Canon 560 and they work perfectly with very good colours.Unfortunately I dont know the American name for them.The only hitch:A note saying there was a 5 percent risk of leak which you would easily notice when you opened them.Mine were pefect though.Their name might be Inktec but .....
Bertil