What Pixma/Stylus should I get?

[Twodordan]

Hello,

My old HP's cartridges have given up after 3 or 4 refills and I definitely want a new printer.

I need a new multifunction printer, for home use. I do take high quality photos, and I do have a decent eye for detail, but I never end up actually printing more than 10 of them per year. I do print in colour fairly often, but just not at photo quality.

My budget is at most $120 / 92Euro / 75 Pounds - tax/transport.
I don't think I really need the PIXMA MG5150, just because of it's 9600 x 2400 dpi.
As listed in the last post here, techtalkz,com/printers/168587-dpi-do-they-make-difference,html , that high a DPI isn't your main concern.

I've been out of the game for some time; what's this about thermal inkjet vs piezoelectric inkjet?
I should probably get a 4 cartridge (CMYK) printer. (I don't know why some have 5.. CMYK+K(?))

I want a decent & reliable printer, with no paper jams or crooked paper intake, no fussy refusal to print if one cartridge is almost empty etc. (Also, I don't really need WiFi. Scanning/printing from/to USB and duplex printing would be good though.)

The most important thing is that I do NOT want to get screwed with the cartridges. They MUST be refillable. I'll have none of that chipped-proprietary-super-expensive-branded-only cartridges crap!
I heard some of the epson stylus' are like that. Particularly Stylus SX425; I also heard the print isn't high quality unless you use their printing software and/or paper.

So what multifunction printer would you recommend?

Thanks for any help/guidance!

 

[qwertydude]

Epson is pretty much out of the question then because if one cartridge is low the printer will refuse to print. Also the Epsons print much slower than Canon or HP, photo quality is better but documents just don't print as high a quality unless you slow the printer down a lot. Although I still love my Epson because it's the only choice for CISS and produces the best photos with their 6 color system. I'd say any older generation CLI-221 series or earlier if at all possible. Canon is your best bet for refilling besides your HP, just get yourself some quality inks, two sets of cartridges and a chip resetter. The 5 ink system for Canon is so you have a larger pigment black for documents. This makes for high print yields for documents and for smudge resistant document prints.

I can tell you the reason for your HP cartridges failing. It's the same for every person that comes here complaining their HP combo cartridges are failing. You let it run dry. The HP is the absolute easiest to refill, but if you ever let it run dry, or low to the point of banding, you introduce air into the system. You might get lucky and when you refill it you can print but after a couple times you end up with flow issues that can burn out the print head. These HP cartridges with the print head built in do not have a purge system. In mine C4150 there is no purge, in fact if you do a cleaning cycle all the printer does is wipe the print head with a squeegee and spray ink onto a collection pad. Mine has a nice little mountain of pigment particles built up in the pad. No purge unit at all. This means that bubbles build up when you let them run out and eventually they ruin the print head. The solution is to just keep topping off the cartridge. Every few weeks I just simply top up the cartridge, sometimes I over fill it but then I just blot the print head on a folded paper towel until the ink stops dripping. Then I simply install the cartridge and print a solid black page or two to help clear out any excess ink. I've refilled my HP carts over 20 times they're almost 2 years old and have never failed. The black cartridge alone must have gone through at least 200 cc's of ink.

Unfortunately the printer that comes unchipped and is easily refillable does not exist. It doesn't make enough money. My suggestion is if you were happy with the print quality of your HP give it one more chance but follow the suggestions I made up top. It will work as long as you never let them run out. Canon would be a good option too but they have their own very particular refill strategies that if you get wrong will cost you a very pricey print head. The HP if you make a mistake at most just buy a new cartridge. I know I went through 2 of the Canon print heads before my printer actually broke. I upgraded to a newer Canon and quickly got tired of the excessive cleaning cycles every time you turn it on. If you're used to your HP springing to life when you press print you'll soon get tired of having to wait 2-3 minutes just for your Canon printer to start printing its first page cause it's going through it's cleaning, preening and pre-flight checklist.

 

[Twodordan]

Thank you for clearing things up!

First of all, my HP is ..OLD. it's a deskjet 5150 from 5 or more years ago. I probably forgot how many times I refilled it, probably more than 3-4. It's also probably more than 5 years old. But yes, everything you said about why my cartridges don't work, is true. (they aren't the original cartridges but still old)

The only printers I owned were 2 HP printers, and neither impressed me. They lasted pretty long, but they needed supervision while printing, as the paper would jam or get fed in at a funny angle, 2 pages at once etc.. The quality/noise/speed weren't great either.

Could you show me where/how do I find CLI-221 canons?

I saw that the Canon Pixma iP4700 got a lot of praise and that you can do THIS: youtube / watch?v=aIBO-P9Y59Y&feature=related to it. (is this the CISS you were referring to?)
But it ain't got a scanner...

So if refilling has become such a pain these days, my best bet probably is to find a multifunction printer that can work with a CIS. Does such a thing exist though? If you have a scanner on top of the printer, I imagine installing CIS would not be possible.
[EDIT] Scratch that^, it seems the Pixma MP series can support CISS: inksystem.com/all-in-one-ciss/canon/
But I can't find any of those on amazon.co.uk. the MP560 was replaced by the MG5150.

 

[Parhs]

Epson is pretty much out of the question then because if one cartridge is low the printer will refuse to print. Also the Epsons print much slower than Canon or HP, photo quality is better but documents just don't print as high a quality unless you slow the printer down a lot. Although I still love my Epson because it's the only choice for CISS and produces the best photos with their 6 color system. I'd say any older generation CLI-221 series or earlier if at all possible. Canon is your best bet for refilling besides your HP, just get yourself some quality inks, two sets of cartridges and a chip resetter. The 5 ink system for Canon is so you have a larger pigment black for documents. This makes for high print yields for documents and for smudge resistant document prints.

I can tell you the reason for your HP cartridges failing. It's the same for every person that comes here complaining their HP combo cartridges are failing. You let it run dry. The HP is the absolute easiest to refill, but if you ever let it run dry, or low to the point of banding, you introduce air into the system. You might get lucky and when you refill it you can print but after a couple times you end up with flow issues that can burn out the print head. These HP cartridges with the print head built in do not have a purge system. In mine C4150 there is no purge, in fact if you do a cleaning cycle all the printer does is wipe the print head with a squeegee and spray ink onto a collection pad. Mine has a nice little mountain of pigment particles built up in the pad. No purge unit at all. This means that bubbles build up when you let them run out and eventually they ruin the print head. The solution is to just keep topping off the cartridge. Every few weeks I just simply top up the cartridge, sometimes I over fill it but then I just blot the print head on a folded paper towel until the ink stops dripping. Then I simply install the cartridge and print a solid black page or two to help clear out any excess ink. I've refilled my HP carts over 20 times they're almost 2 years old and have never failed. The black cartridge alone must have gone through at least 200 cc's of ink.

Unfortunately the printer that comes unchipped and is easily refillable does not exist. It doesn't make enough money. My suggestion is if you were happy with the print quality of your HP give it one more chance but follow the suggestions I made up top. It will work as long as you never let them run out. Canon would be a good option too but they have their own very particular refill strategies that if you get wrong will cost you a very pricey print head. The HP if you make a mistake at most just buy a new cartridge. I know I went through 2 of the Canon print heads before my printer actually broke. I upgraded to a newer Canon and quickly got tired of the excessive cleaning cycles every time you turn it on. If you're used to your HP springing to life when you press print you'll soon get tired of having to wait 2-3 minutes just for your Canon printer to start printing its first page cause it's going through it's cleaning, preening and pre-flight checklist.

As i told you that was one of my mistakes...letting the cartidge dry! However i see that you dont like/recommend Canon printers. But most threads here are about Canon!
However i am having paper jams with my printer always when i try to print double side and every HP printer i have seen has issues..However your success with your HP printer is great

Does the same apply for canon printers?(not letting them dry)

 

[qwertydude]

Most threads here are about older generations of Canon's you'll see there is a good consensus that every newer generation gets worse. First it was the switch from BCI to CLI-221, smaller cartridges, and tougher to get a chip resetter, not to mention shoddier construction with getting rid of the stainless print head guide bar and replacing it with bent sheet metal. Then when a resetter does come out, we get a new generation of printers, IP4700, older one was IP4600. Doesn't seem like much of a change but the firmware seemed a bit more wasteful of ink especially if you refilled the cartridge and disabled ink monitoring. Not too bad. The straw that broke the camel's back in my case was opaque cartridges in the CLI-226 series. It's important because everyone here recommends OEM carts but now OEM carts aren't convenient to fill, and can't be manually monitored, and there's no resetter yet and likely won't be until the next generation of Canon printer. Therefore the newest Canon is very refill unfriendly. So everyone's advice and positive comments for Canon's are almost exclusively the older generation of printers. CLI-221 version 1 and before which are getting increasingly rarer to buy and print heads are scarce for them when you do get one so you have to refill them very carefully so you don't burn print heads out.

 

[Twodordan]

every newer generation gets worse.

^ It's true! I've been busting my ass for the past week trying to find a good canon (cartridge wise) and all I found was discontinued models.

Qwertydude, you mentioned you have an Epson with CISS? I can't find any suitable pixmas on amazon (or anywhere that ships in the EU).
Which Epson was it?

Would Epson Stylus SX415 be any good? amazon.co.uk/Epson-Stylus-SX415-Printer-Individual/dp/B0029U2FOI/ref=sr_1_14?s=computers&ie=UTF8&qid=1294485385&sr=1-14

The SX515 looks shiny but it's over my budget...

[EDIT] How about a laserjet? They're very big and a good colour laserjet costs a fortune (especially for a home user), but do you happen to know of any decent ones?

 

[The Hat]

Parhs However i am having paper jams with my printer always when i try to print double side and every HP printer i have seen has issues..However your success with your HP printer is great

Does the same apply for canon printers?(not letting them dry)

Canon printers in general dont have a problem with paper jams and are great for double-side (Duplex) printing.
The Canon cartridges are about the best around for refilling and dont have a problem refilling when showing empty..