Newbie - Canon MP780 do I need CD to install?

[bahjan]

First - hello all !
Second - cards on the table - I am a complete Newbie to Multifunction printers. If I tell you my old printer was a Canon BJC 4000 you'll get the idea - (though I'm not as old as you might think!)

I have just bought a MP780 for a very cheap price. I went for Canon again as I like their reliability and the relatively easy way to get at the printhead (for checking/cleaning purposes) I went for the MP780 because it was one of last non-chipped cartridge models (that is such sharp practice to my mind). My printing needs are light, but I needed an all-in-one unit that printed and scanned because of space issues.....

I'm afraid 'Waste Ink Pads' and 'purge units' are all new to me - but I am sure this forum will be invaluable. The Waste ink of this unit is at 72.6% but I do not know if the counter has ever been reset. An extended nozzle check seemed pretty good, but a trial colour copy caused lines on the block yellow (but I am assuming this is mostly because yellow is low?) Both the yellow and cyan are showing 1 bar on the LCD - does the printer warn about low ink, what % is the lowest before damage might be done to the printhead? I'll have to check out the printhead, but I've not seen any 'wrong cartridge' messages, so at best I am assuming printhead might need a gentle clean. I am considering given the low cost I paid, having the printer serviced. Here in the UK there is an online company called printerrepairservices.co.uk - anyone ever used them?

Anyway my first question is probably a dumb one - do I need the CD to install this printer? I have downloaded various drivers on to my HD:
1. Print scan driver m5306enx.exe
2. MP Navigator v 1.04 M590Bmux.exe
3 CD/label cdlpwin130aen.exe

I don't need the fax driver as don't want to use it. I assume it's okay not to install it.

I am running an XP Pro SP3 laptop by the way.....I've never used a printer with a USB connection. I have read elsewhere of the dangers of a power serge from the printer damaging your PC, but I don't know what kind of an issue that can be. Is there anyway of monitoring power levels?

Anyway, can some kind soul talk this newbie through any do's and don'ts of installation - or is it all in Canon's quick start PDF's? I was a little surprised to see the manual download appear as an application rather than PDF - I don't like being forced to install 'stuff' - I'm personally allergic to the tendency some companies have to opt for bloatware/spyware - (a ranting Jekyll is likely to appear)... I'm not saying Canon is one of them, but why does the manual have to be an app? Must I use Explorer to read it - if so, that's a pure pain - I prefer other browsers like FF3.

 

[ruffin]

Get these drivers from here:

http://www.usa.canon.com/consumer/c...ategoryid=123&modelid=10444#DownloadDetailAct

MP780 MP Driver Ver. 600a for Windows XP

MP780 MP Driver Ver. 6.0 updater (Windows XP/2000)

My Printer Ver. 2.3.0 (Windows 7/7 x64/Vista/Vista64/XP/2000)

MP Navigator Ver. 1.05 (Windows 7/7 x64/Vista/Vista64/XP/2000

Optional listed below:

Easy-PhotoPrint Ver. 3.7.0 (Windows Vista/Vista x64/XP/2000/Me/98)

Easy-WebPrint Ver. 2.6.4 (Windows XP/2000/Me/98)

PIXMA_MP750_780_Quick_Start_Guide_EN.pdf

PIXMA_MP780_750_Easy_Setup_Instructions_EN.pdf

User Guide PIXMA_MP780_750_UG_Win_EN.EXE

PIXMA_MP780_750_Software_Guide_Win_EN.EXE

PIXMA_MP780_750_Photo_Application_Guide_Win_EN.EXE

You should not require Install CD with these downloads. Do not connect USB cable until driver has been installed. Follow Quick Start pdf and Easy Setup pdf instructions. Good luck with the installation. Regards

 

[ghwellsjr]

Let me re-emphasize what Ruffin said--Don't connect the printer to the computer via the USB cable until after you install the printer driver. Actually the installation process will tell you when to make the connection so make sure your printer is ready to go.

I believe you have made the best decision about buying the MP780. I would not take (or send) it to a repair shop, you have no idea what they are going to do and you can do everything yourself. I have posted extensive instructions to enable you to install the waste ink pads if and when that becomes necessary. You probably can go another couple years before it will be necessary. In the meantime, I would advise that you get a set of the Ink Absorber Pads from a local authorized Canon dealer or from Canon directly or from a mail order service that sells them.

You asked about the purge unit. It is very easy to tell if it is working. First do a nozzle check. Make sure all the colors are printing starting with the pigment black at the top and ending with the dye black at the bottom. Then remove the cartridges and do two deep head cleanings (called "head refreshing" from the control panel on the printer). This will flush most of the ink out of the print head if the purge unit is working. Then do another nozzle check. This time, you should get an almost blank page. Let us know the outcome of this experiment.

Assuming that the purge unit is working, I would recommend that you now remove the flushed print head from the printer to clean the bottom of it. Make sure you put the locking lever back down so it doesn't get jammed when the printer decides to move the carriage back to the right. Also unplug the printer with the carriage in the middle so this can't happern.

To clean the bottom of the print head, take a paper towel (don't you call that a kitchen paper or something like that in the UK?) and fold it in quarters. Put some window cleaner or water on it and press the print head on the wet paper towel over and over again as long as ink is deposited. It's kind of like using an address stamp. Use more wet paper towels until no more ink comes out. Then do the same thing on a dry paper towel.

You have to be very careful that you do not let residual ink or water or any other liquid from getting to the inside of the print head or any other part except the bottom as this can fry the electronics when you put the print head back in the printer and turn it on. As long as you only let liquid from the wet paper towels contact the bottom of the print head, you'll be safe. If you do get liquid any where else, you should put the print head in a warm spot for two days to make sure it is thoroughly dry before putting it back in the printer. Failure to follow these rules can result in a dead print head and a dead printer so take heed.

After you return the cleaned print head back to the printer, install the ink cartridges, plug it in and turn it on. You can hit the reset button when it asks if you want to do an alignment, it takes a long time and you can do it later. Just do a nozzle check, it will take some time while the printer primes the print head using the purge unit to suck ink through the nozzles. I you see some obvious problems, let us know, do not use the printer, because using it with clogged nozzles can permanently burn them out. Even if it looks good for the regular nozzle check, you should also do an extended nozzle check, because that is the only way to know for sure that every dye ink nozzle is working. Again, if any nozzle are not working, let us know, and don't use your printer for anything other than nozzle checks or you could burn it out.

You asked about ink levels. On the older Canon printers that do not have chips in the cartridges, the printer can only tell the difference between a cartridge with no ink in the reservoir (the narrower tank part of the cartridge that does not have the sponge material in it) and any other condition, such as a cartridge with ink in the reservoir or no cartridge at all. We'll call the first condition the "empty tank" and any other condition a "full tank", even though it may only be half full or not even present.

Whenever the printer detects an empty tank, it shows one thin bar on the ink level display and puts up a yellow alert. As soon as you remove an empty tank cartridge (whether or not you put in a full tank cartridge) the printer will think that you have installed a new cartridge and the display will show all bars indicating full. When a cartridge goes to an empty tank condition or a full tank condition, it starts counting ink drops from that cartridge and when it thinks a sufficient amount of ink has been used up, it takes away a bar. If it was a full tank, it will now show half full. If it was an empty tank, it will now show a red empty warning.

This means that for reliable level indications, you should never remove a cartridge that has an empty tank unless you immediately replace it with a full tank cartridge. Now I have just told you to violate this rule by cleaning your print head so it is important that you understand how the level sensor works. Basically, as long as there is ink in the tank, the level will not indicate either a yellow or red warning and you are safe to print. It doesn't really matter if the level shows full or half full because as soon as the tank becomes empty, it will reliably indicate the low ink level with a yellow alert. But now suppose you use the printer for awhile and use up half the ink remaining in the sponge part of the cartridge. The printer will know this. But if you remove the cartridge and allow the print head to sense the levels, it will think you have put in a full cartridge. If you then re-install the cartridge with half the ink used out of the sponge, the printer will erroneously think it is a full sponge. When the printer thinks the sponge is half full, it will really be empty and you are in danger of running your nozzles dry for that color. So you should not swap cartridges that have empty tanks. You should always replace them with cartridges that have at least some ink in their tanks.

If any of this is unclear, just ask again. We want you to have a successful printer experience.

 

[bahjan]

Hi,

Okay, here's the thing. I thought I'd do the cleaning first before trying software install.

I couldn't figure out how to do a standard nozzle check - okay that's sorted it's under 'maintainance' - so I followed instructions and did an extended one instead. This showed a misfire on cyan, but when I opened the unit to remove the tanks to cycle clean the printhead as recommended, it looked to me as if the ink resevoir for cyan and yellow are empty. I have more carts.

Anyway, when I followed Canon's instructions and pressed Menu repeatedly to try and get to 'Maintainance' to do a deep clean nothing happens, the machine beeps at me and stays on 3: Printer, cycling through the printer options.

Also, pressing on/off does nothing - again the printer bleeps.

Does this indicate an electrical problem with the unit - or is it me being extraordinarily thick? (Wouldn't be the first time).

The inks are out and the machine is on. I'll persist in trying to get it to do something - Canon's pdf not very helpful.....

Okay so I unplugged the unit (maybe I shouldn't) and did two head refreshing - nozzle check showed tiny amount of black and magenta so did two more head cleans until nozzle check was clean. Replaced inks and put in new ones for cyan and yellow - and did another nozzle check (Std) - there are no error messages to say I installed cartridges wrongly, but nothing is printing.....? (maybe I should try more than once, but I didn't want to force anything and possibly damage the machine). I'll try cleaning the printhead and report back. - A lot of ink on it (although by eye it looks okay) - so I'll clean it, make sure it's dry and report back in a day or two.

What does 'Change H Value' mean?

Update:

Used plain water to clean the printhead. Quite a bit of ink came out of it, especially cyan. Dried thoroughly, reinstalled with new yellow and cyan inks. Plugged in machine, allowed the head to park and performed a deep head clean. Then -

Nozzle Check:

3eBK - Should their be some fine line breaks in 3eBK? (I'll have a look at some images)
6C - seems okay with lower half of the blue deeper colour
6C - light cyan seems okay
6M - Magenta dark okay
6M - light okay
6Y - Yellow okay
6BK - gray - seems okay.

Then I did an extended check: ink now at 74.6% - does the percentage normally go up that quickly? So far I have done 4 deep head cleanings.

Some breaks on 3eBK as before - and nozzles on cyan seem blocked as top bar prints but other three below seem patchy. Magenta, yellow and 6Bk nozzle check seems fine. The MP780 has come out in magenta. What's the best thing to do about the cyan?

I still can't get the on/off switch to respond - I press it and all I get is a bleep. Can I switch it off from the nozzle check mode or do I have to put it in some other mode before on/off will respond? Point is, I don't want to invest in the machine until I know it's working - I have 14 days return on it which began on Tues when it arrived. I have read it's best not to print anything until nozzle checks are okay.

Looking at other posts it seems I have a problem with cyan and 3eBK oddly standard check makes the cyan look okay but extended nozzle check reveals breaks in the cyan - I assume therefore the nozzle is blocked? If it's a new printhead I need I am not prepared to invest in one till I can get to the bottom of on/off and printing issues. Seems ridiculous to have to pull out the plug to turn the thing off......?

Forgot to mention when I plug in the printer 'please wait' comes up and an orange light flashes, I assume this light is the warning light that will come on if the printer detects something wrong. Hasn't indicated anything so far....

 

[bahjan]

Here are some images: couldn't seem to post actual images, just the links (sorry!)

http://www.nifty-stuff.com/forum/uploads/5533_mp780_test_pg030.jpg
This one shows test colour copy before print head clean.


http://www.nifty-stuff.com/forum/uploads/5533_mp780_extd_det029.jpg

After print head clean - detail of cyan - I may have to clean again??


http://www.nifty-stuff.com/forum/uploads/5533_mp780_std027.jpg

Standard print head test post clean


http://www.nifty-stuff.com/forum/uploads/5533_mp780_extd028.jpg

extended test - post clean

Is print head needing replaced, or would it be worth trying to clean with window cleaner? Is it ammonia based cleaner I need - the kind for window and glass?

 

[ghwellsjr]

Your nozzle checks show that you have an electrical problem on the upper cyan set of nozzles. The upper half is not printing fully. This cannot be fixed except by buying a new print head. You can still try to clean the print head using Windex or other window cleaner, preferably with ammonia but if you are located in a country that bans ammonia then just use any window cleaner. If you ever remove the print head from the printer to clean it, make sure you let it sit for two days in a warm spot for it to dry before returning it to the printer or you can risk damaging both the print head and the printer.

If you cannot turn off the printer by holding down the On/Off button for a few seconds, try first pressing the Stop/Reset button several times. It does take awhile to shut down because it has to park the head. If that doesn't work, you may want to consider returning the printer unless it was very cheap, say $20 or less. I would keep a printer like that just for part in case it doesn't work out in other respects. But then, I really like the MP780 because its cartridges don't have chips in them making it very easy to refill and it is much more solidly built than any of the new Canon printers.

When did you see "Change H Value"? It sounds to me like it might have been during a manual alignment but then it would have asked about a lot of other values.

 

[bahjan]

Thanks for the advice - I did wonder whether it was a new print head I was needing. I may try using window cleaner. Yes I put the head on a paper towel in a saucer then put it on a gently warm (not very hot) radiator to make sure it was dry

The on/off does work if I press the stop/reset - so I think basic functions are okay.

The 'Change H Value' did appear when I was in manual alignment mode - I didn't change any of the settings.

I agree, it looks like a solidly made machine - I am sure I'll be very pleased with it- just have to get a print head and install some new waste ink pads.

 

[ghwellsjr]

This is all good news. I would suggest that you contact a local Canon authorized repair shop and see if they have a print head and two sets of ink absorber pads (they are only $7). If they don't have them in stock, see if they will order them for you. If you can't get them locally, see if you can order them from Canon.

I would not suggest that you install the ink absorber pads until the printer reaches 100% which could be over a year from now. You need to get some use out of your printer first.

 

[bahjan]

Hi,

Feeling I had nothing to loose I tried cleaning the printhead again, first with water, then a isopropyl alcohol. A lot of ink came out, and when I was sufficiently satisfied no more would emerge, I dried the head throughly, reintalled it and did another extended nozzle test.

The same cyan problem occurred, assuring me that a new print head is needed, but much to my surprise (and dismay) the first black hatch test is now not printing. I checked the purge pads by flooding them with water, and they appear to be working. If the problem is with the first smaller black tank, I did notice during cleaning when I dripped IPA on the inside nozzle, that it and the large black next to it didn't suck the liquid as readily as the colour nozzles. I have since tried IPA on the purge pads. There's one thing I don't get - on a regular nozzle check print both blacks seem to work, while on the extended one they don't? Plenty of ink present so I don't think low ink level is an issue.
Just had to replace cyan ink (machine told me it was empty) - why is extended check now only printing cyan? Took out the print head - noticed bottom of the print head was flooded with cyan. Blotted it with dry kitchen towel and reinstalled printer head. Asked for
'Head Alignment - Press OK' did so and got this message 'Cannot use paper cassette in asf' What's that about? There was paper in the tray. I switched unit off and on a did a couple of cleaning cycles - in the meantime replaced yellow ink too as it was out. After a couple of cleaning cycles, some of the black is back on extended nozzle check, though now the info line at the top - (purge pads now 75.9 by the way) - is only half printed (bottom half present) I assume more printing cleanings may help. There is a little bleeding of colours - I assume that's because the bottom of the print head was flooded..... I assume a few more cleaning cycles is the sensible way to go?

 

[ghwellsjr]

The sensible way to go is to get a new print head. You cannot fix your cyan problem with cleanings and you run the risk of damaging your printer by cleaning the print head outside the printer unless you wait two days for it to dry, which it sounds like you are doing. Still, when you do cleanings inside the printer, you are just making the day come earlier when you will have to replace the waste ink absorber pads.

I also do not recommend using alcohol, you run the risk of damaging the seals inside the print head that keeps the colors separate. Window cleaner or just plain water will work just fine.

When you do a Head Alignment, you must have paper in the rear paper source--it will not work with the paper in the cassette underneath the printer. The same is true for an extended nozzle check--it uses paper from the rear. I wouldn't do any head alignments until you get the nozzles working because they are not going to work and they take a long time to do. Just hit the Stop/Reset button when it asks you if you want to do it.